Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

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Dr Exiled
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Dr Exiled »

DCP goes on and on in post after post about being attacked over here. Yet, he continually brings up the subject and continually posts in response to what is said over here. He has to love the attention, playing victim.
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

Peterson’s victimhood stance reminded me that last year Gadianton documented that Peterson originated the “meat unit” insult directed at gemli, with of course, Midgley’s enthusiastic support:
Gadianton wrote:
Tue Jul 02, 2019 7:55 pm
Gad wrote:emphasis added. OMG.

Also note that in calling Gemli a rotting bag of meat, twice, both DCP and Kiwi up-voted the accusation.
I've been responded to. Thank you for the response, in this thread:

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... qus_thread
DCP wrote:Amusingly, over at the Peterson Obsession Board, where they've made misreading into both an art form and an imperative, some of the inmates are attacking YOU for the contemptuous character of GEMLI's description of human persons.
No no, it's not fundamentally Midgley's or Gemli's description, the origin of the description is with DCP himself:
DCP wrote:I believe that this emission is an example of what naïve sentimentalists, with their tendency to anthropomorphize random products of biochemical evolution, call “thought.”

It’s not a very good one, though.

Along with others, I’ve regularly asked this particular meat-unit exactly which element of the scientific method theists are obliged to mock or reject.
DCP began to call Gemli a "meat unit" as a way to mock Gemli personally for his position of reductivism:

https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... y-lad.html

However, while not very nice, probably rating on the "not nice" scale the same as a barb against Mormonism from William Lane Craig, in the hands of Midgley, the barb becomes an aluminum bat, and he "can't stop" until he's pulled away by others. Interestingly, Lou recognizes the origin of the barb (from the comment section):
Midgley wrote:My hunch is that by "experimental" what gemli has in mind is pestering rats and mice on the assumption that by doing this one can explain away the soul of human beings and hence see everyone as merely an unusual complicated It or Meat Unit, to use Professor Peterson's clever derogatory description of gemli's ideology.
So, lol, omg, folks, you can't make this stuff up. I may have my new sig line, with this quote from Midgley.

Then later in the thread, Gemli, the stand-up guy he is, rolls with the punches:
Gemli wrote:Human beings are meat units. They're not magical. They think wrong thing
In the same way that early Christians went with it and called themselves "Christians" when they were scornfully referred to as "Christies". If the apologists can find a clear example -- or if Gemli wants to help them -- of Gemli referring to himself as meat wad prior to this post, then they might have a defense. The problem is, this is the first instances I believe of the trio all using the term, and using it in response to the clear introduction of the term by the blog owner.

notice how Kiwi ratchets up the insult:
Is it politeness, or is it the fact that "it" - presumably the meat unit known by the posting handle of "gemli" - hasn't read the Book of Mormon, and so is in no position to comment on its contents?
Midgley's mean-spiritedness shines through, riffing on Kiwi's next layer implication -- that a meat unit is an "it" without feelings:
I wonder if It will moan that we are mocking him, and are mean, which he never does and hence is always nice, and therefore wins some debate that he imagines he is having.
And these kinds of insults have increased. Now, Midgley is stepping back and agreeing with DCP that it was Gemli who started this, and to paraphrase " pray tell, aren't I just saying exactly what Gemli said? He said meat wad, isn't a rotting piece of meat just another way of saying that? And as I express this presently, I'm relaxed and not spun up and aggravated as in the other examples so this is okay, right? This is how you wanted us to refer to you. Ya, you just said that. Those guys over there are making stuff up out of thin air."

Not very nice, guys. Certainly, the harassing of Gemli, even if he's a good sport, goes well beyond any "not niceness" exhibited by William Lane Craig.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

Peterson, forgetting he originated the “meat unit” insult, describes his own behavior:

DanielPeterson Mod Moksha • an hour ago

Moksha: "Gemli might use the term "meatwad" for an effect, but a never read into it any denigration of the dignity of human nature."

Neither have I. And I'm sure that he does use it for effect. I don't confuse gemli with Hitler.

But it's only a short step -- not at all a leap, and really quite reasonable -- from regarding humans as "meat wads" and as no more significant than cockroaches to putting them in extermination camps, treating them as cannon fodder, seeing them as intrinsically without value, exploiting them as mere means to one's own ends.

http://disq.us/p/29z3ibs
So Peterson, in defining gemli as a “meat unit” and an “it”, is only a short step from seeing him “as intrinsically without value.”

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

It’s also worth noting that Peterson started describing gemli as a “meat unit“ and an “it” not in a comment, but in the body of a blog entry, posted Nov 22, 2018.

I’ve regularly asked this particular meat-unit exactly which element of the scientific method theists are obliged to mock or reject. I’ve routinely sought to know precisely which accomplishment of science this particular carbon-based life form imagines that I’m compelled to disdain or to disavow.



But it never answers.


https://www.patheos.com/blogs/danpeters ... y-lad.html

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

Hmm. Kiwi seems to have a memory problem.

Kiwi57 Fred Kratz • 16 minutes ago

That's because you haven't seen me attempt to dehumanize those I despise. At all.

You are clearly projecting when you make that accusation.

"Sheeple" is a label used by your crowd, as they attempt to dehumanize those they despise.
Um....
Kiwi57, January 2020:

...the denizens of the Sty grunted, oinked, brayed, hooted and screeched....

http://disq.us/p/26u35fj

[discussed here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52916&start=21 ]
Kiwi57, at his dehumanizing best.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

Kiwi is cracking me up.
Fred Kratz Kiwi57 • an hour ago

So you've never referred to those you clearly despise as "swine"?



——-
Kiwi57 Fred Kratz • 44 minutes ago

No.

I've used the word "swine" to refer to those who feel comfortable at a certain rather revolting internet location, correctly described as "the sty." But that is only because a sty is an enclosure for swine. A sty would be incomplete without some swine to live in it.

http://disq.us/p/29z6mgr
So kiwi has NEVER used “dehumanizing” language. Except, of course, when discussing the humans whom he defines as inhabiting a sty. Because sties have to have swine. Hence, the humans at the place HE defines as a sty MUST be swine. And therefore he can call them swine. Because they are. What logic. Will kiwi ever grow out of this post-toddler fantastical-lying phase?

Peterson hustles in to rescue the flailing kiwi:
Fred Kratz Kiwi57 • 26 minutes ago

Well, it's a good thing you never dehumanize others then even though, if one searches your droppings, they're liable to find language that is clearly dehumanizing. And you do it while hiding your identity. You're a class act.


—-
Kiwi57 Fred Kratz • 15 minutes ago

And in our next instalment, Fred will tell us how bad it is to judge people.

But in the meantime, what are your thoughts on Dan's blog post? You know, the ostensible topic to which all of our comments are supposed to relate? Do you agree that humans are nothing more than sentient goo?


—-
Fred Kratz Kiwi57 • 5 minutes ago

You really, really should re-read the stuff you've written including attacking people while offering exactly zero to the topic at hand.

I've been reading your comments for years and I have no problem judging you for them just as you regularly judge and dehumanize others while hiding your identity.


—-
DanielPeterson Mod Fred Kratz • 4 minutes ago

FK, do you have anything to say about scientific reductionism? You appear to be in favor of it. Is that correct? Please advise.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Gadianton »

The Proprietor of Sic et Non has a new post wherewith much righteousness of the self declares:
DCP quotes Clayton Christensen wrote: And when I have been subsequently confronted with opportunities to look at pornography or not pay my tithing, or compromise on others of God’s commandments, this lesson that I learned has been very important. The lesson is it really is easier to keep the commandments 100 percent of the time than it is 98 percent of the time.
That might hold true as the Proprietor and his gang battle the temptations of pornography and withholding tithes. But when it comes to the commandment, "Thou shalt love they neighbor as thy self", Peterson, Kiwi57, and Lou Midgley clearly find it easier to keep this commandment 2% of the time, rather than either 98% or 100% of the time.
FARMS refuted:

"...supporters of Billy Meier still point to the very clear photos of Pleiadian beam ships flying over his farm. They argue that for the photos to be fakes, we have to believe that a one-armed man who had no knowledge of Photoshop or other digital photography programs could have made such realistic photos and films..." -- D. R. Prothero

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Philo Sofee »

Gadianton wrote:
Tue Jun 16, 2020 5:37 pm
The Proprietor of Sic et Non has a new post wherewith much righteousness of the self declares:
DCP quotes Clayton Christensen wrote: And when I have been subsequently confronted with opportunities to look at pornography or not pay my tithing, or compromise on others of God’s commandments, this lesson that I learned has been very important. The lesson is it really is easier to keep the commandments 100 percent of the time than it is 98 percent of the time.
That might hold true as the Proprietor and his gang battle the temptations of pornography and withholding tithes. But when it comes to the commandment, "Thou shalt love they neighbor as thy self", Peterson, Kiwi57, and Lou Midgley clearly find it easier to keep this commandment 2% of the time, rather than either 98% or 100% of the time.
OUCH! That has just got to hurt!
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Doctor CamNC4Me »

In response to this kind and equitable statement by Moksha: “I would prefer a simple world, where those who could do the most good are not also seeking to inflict harm on others. It would be great if they could just embrace the golden rule and only do what they would like for themselves.”

Lyin’ Li’l Lou Midgley snaps with this odd diatribe:

“You posted the following remark above: "Why did Romney join in? Did Kavanaugh ply him with some **shudder** beer?"
I assume that Moksha considers that remark really either funny or Moksha is again sneering at faithful Latter-day Saints. Either way, Moksha should try to think before posting. If Moksha actually has something that he happened to take seriously, would Moksha like some jerk to be constantly mocking and sneering at it? If not, then Moksha might consider ceasing to constantly mock others, should he not? Or perhaps Moksha should just admit to himself and to us that he is a bloody hypocrite.“

The keeviler elf missed the obvious joke about Kavanaugh liking to drink beer.

Sigh...

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Dr Exiled »

The Midge is so at the ready to attack, in the name of religion of all things. He would contact a family member's Stake President/Bishop if that family member wanted to publish something unorthodox in Sunstone or Dialogue. The guy would rat out his own mother if she came out against the most holy LGT.
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Gadianton »

Ah, thanks Lemmie, now I see why you posted a link to that explanation I gave a while back. The proprietor has recently defended his dehumanizing language (actually, it was Midgley's, and he's putting himself into the line of fire as he often does), and among other things says, "They seemed unaware that the term was his." (the term 'meat wad')

As I documented long ago, the term "meat unit" came from DCP himself, not Gemli. Gemli may have gone with the flow but he did not invent the term. The proprietor can find my link above, and if he can find an earlier reference then great, otherwise it's just an empty claim like pretty much everything else he writes.

Hey, "Christians" did the same thing Gemli is doing, right? Wear the insult as a badge of honor? It's a pretty common tactic, and the Mopologists shouldn't read so much into it. "Derrr, Gemli gone done and said it again, boss!"
FARMS refuted:

"...supporters of Billy Meier still point to the very clear photos of Pleiadian beam ships flying over his farm. They argue that for the photos to be fakes, we have to believe that a one-armed man who had no knowledge of Photoshop or other digital photography programs could have made such realistic photos and films..." -- D. R. Prothero

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »

Dr. Shades Kiwi57 • 4 hours ago • edited

[kiwi] “That's because you haven't seen me attempt to dehumanize those I despise. At all. . . I've used the word "swine" to refer to those who feel comfortable at a certain rather revolting internet location, correctly described as "the sty." “

I'm impressed! Not even George Orwell himself could've come up with a more egregious example of "Doublethink."


——
Kiwi57 Dr. Shades • 3 hours ago • edited

Not as impressed as I am. Not even Jerald Tanner could have come up with a more brazen example of ellipsis abuse.

Prodigious as your talents for deceit are, the shamelessness of your effrontery is what makes your efforts truly stand out.

http://disq.us/p/29zatdz

Speaking of the shamelessness of effrontery....
Kiwi57, January 2020:

...the denizens of the Sty grunted, oinked, brayed, hooted and screeched....

http://disq.us/p/26u35fj

[discussed here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52916&start=21 ]
Kiwi the Shameless needs to brush up on his memory skills. Dr. Shades’ use of ellipsis captured his “DoubleThink” perfectly.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Gadianton »

The Proprietor also quotes:
Ivan Kershaw wrote:Human life and suffering was . . . of no consequence to him. He never visited a field-hospital, nor the homeless after bomb-raids. He saw no massacres, went near no concentration camp, viewed no compound of starving prisoners-of-war. His enemies were in his eyes like vermin to be stamped out. But his profound contempt for human existence extended to his own people. Decisions costing the lives of tens of thousands of his soldiers were made . . . without consideration for any human plight. [Ian Kershaw, Hitler: 1936-1945: Nemesis (New York: W. W. Norton and Company, 2000), 500-501.]
The proprietor comments on the quote:
The Proprietor of Sic et Non wrote:This is a distasteful but not entirely unreasonable consequence of viewing humans as “meat wads” on a par with monkeys, cockroaches, and “piles of sentient goo” — a view that is emphatically not mine.
If the Proprietor knew how to read, he'd see that the quote has nothing to do with reductionism. The quote said that Hitler reigned from an ivory tower with no real-world connection to the horrors his efforts inflicted on others. Similar in kind if differing in degree would be complaints from stuffy white professors that disgruntled blacks should be serving in soup kitchens rather than rioting.

And speaking of Gemli's quips about sentient goo "getting over itself", Gemli's observations aren't so different from Hugh Nibley's. Nibley looked for ways to bring humility to the a great ego that he believed mankind had been saddled with. Nibley quoted from the Apocalypse of Abraham, where Abraham observed the inner workings of stars and exclaimed that "truly mankind is nothing" when compared to the greatness of the heavens. Gemli is just inverting the framework that has been forced upon him by the Proprietor and making a similar point.
FARMS refuted:

"...supporters of Billy Meier still point to the very clear photos of Pleiadian beam ships flying over his farm. They argue that for the photos to be fakes, we have to believe that a one-armed man who had no knowledge of Photoshop or other digital photography programs could have made such realistic photos and films..." -- D. R. Prothero

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by moksha »

Louis Midgley Doctor Dunkenstein • 5 months ago
I also kept a modest file on W. Cleon Skousen. But so did the FBI, which investigated him three times. The FBI file is now fully available through the Freedom of Information Act. He was much less than he made himself out to be. And I once published essays in Dialogue that demonstrated that he was less than honest, and very poorly informed. Should anyone have taken seriously anything peddled by the John Birch Society?

And I also assembled a large file on and by John Dehlin, who was one of my former students. I had much more that Greg Smith could have drawn upon for his debunking of Dehlin.

And I have been printing, if not all, most of the items that Dr. VelhoBurrinho on sic et non, but not those he posts on a dreadful board. Hence, even though he has blocked access to what he has posted on Dan's blog, just as you have, I have a nice file on the Little Old Donkey. Why? When someone falsely claims that I have a latent hostility to Maori Latter-day Saints, that caught my attention.

Files are what historians assemble. By disposition and expert training my professional life has been writing intellectual history.
Can you imagine how the Colvin and McCluskey files have grown, not to mention the Gadianton, Shades, Bokovoy, Reiss, Brooks, Gemli, and that dog down the street which constantly barks when I go out to get the mail files?
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Doctor CamNC4Me »

Lyin' Lou Midgley's story continues to evolve as he now claims that Ms. Colvin's husband arranged the meeting with him:

"No, not at all. Dr. Shades should set out the "superior argumentation" of those of those, for example, who insisted that I had not met and befriended Gina Colvin's husband? And that he and the Stake President had not desired and hence planned on that wonderful meeting? Or the "superior argumentation" that the "Colvins" should avoid me, since there are no Colvins. Why? Colvin is not the surname of the Gina's husband. His name is McCluskey, and not Colvin. Everything about the comments directed at me that you applauded were demonic--that is, radically wrong and intentionally wicked. END OF STORY!"

This evil little liar shows the world what happens to you when you're protected from your own actions throughout your life. Good thing he found a way to weasel his way in at BYU and get the LDS church to pay for his being an asshole for 50 years, because there's no way this like gutrot would make it outside the Utah county bubble.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Philo Sofee »

If poor Lyin Lou only knew how to keep files on all the stuff he says so he could keep his stupid stories straight.....what a dope. He's Donald Trump's secret Playmate, lies so much there is no reason to believe anything that man ever says, no matter how sincerely. I know I don't.
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Gadianton »

Hi Dan and Kiwi57. I just thought I'd remind you both that on the same blog post where Mr. Migdley announced his upcoming visit to New Zealand and requested an address from Dr. Colvin, that he downvoted every nice comment made to Dr. Colvin and upvoted every derogatory comment, including this one, which again, was made towards Dr. Colvin:
Comment Mr. Midgley upvoted wrote: Your courage seems like artifice. Move on. You don't have what it takes to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ. I get it. Your name is Legion. There's a million of you.
That's all any rational observer would ever need to know to confirm it best to to end any attempts to confront Dr. Colvin IRL either directly, or through her family, and any such continued efforts no matter how they presumably came about, could only make him look bad. Save the stories about SP's and hubby begging for him to visit them.

And guess what? That's what happened. He did something he knew was wrong, you all egged him on, and his efforts did in fact make him look bad. Congratulations to all of you for that!
FARMS refuted:

"...supporters of Billy Meier still point to the very clear photos of Pleiadian beam ships flying over his farm. They argue that for the photos to be fakes, we have to believe that a one-armed man who had no knowledge of Photoshop or other digital photography programs could have made such realistic photos and films..." -- D. R. Prothero

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by moksha »

Doctor CamNC4Me wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 4:50 pm
Midgley wrote:Dr. Shades should set out the "superior argumentation" of those of those, for example, who insisted that I had not met and befriended Gina Colvin's husband? And that he and the Stake President had not desired and hence planned on that wonderful meeting?
-----------------
To recipients L-Skinny List: Dear Brothers of the sacred goat horns, I want to travel once again to New Zealand to relive the memories of when I first arrived to share the gospel with the inhabitants of that land. However, I also want to complete a side project. I've been hounding this New Zealand apostate named "Gina" and I want to attend her home ward in order to ambush her in true Midgley style. Could you reach out to your agents abroad and help me arrange that?
- Doc
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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Doctor Scratch »

Gadianton wrote:
Wed Jun 17, 2020 8:40 pm
Hi Dan and Kiwi57. I just thought I'd remind you both that on the same blog post where Mr. Migdley announced his upcoming visit to New Zealand and requested an address from Dr. Colvin, that he downvoted every nice comment made to Dr. Colvin and upvoted every derogatory comment, including this one, which again, was made towards Dr. Colvin:
Comment Mr. Midgley upvoted wrote: Your courage seems like artifice. Move on. You don't have what it takes to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ. I get it. Your name is Legion. There's a million of you.
That's all any rational observer would ever need to know to confirm it best to to end any attempts to confront Dr. Colvin IRL either directly, or through her family, and any such continued efforts no matter how they presumably came about, could only make him look bad. Save the stories about SP's and hubby begging for him to visit them.

And guess what? That's what happened. He did something he knew was wrong, you all egged him on, and his efforts did in fact make him look bad. Congratulations to all of you for that!
Very well said, Dr. Robbers. The Mopologists have been engaging in this type of behavior for decades, and of course they egg each other on. The thing that baffles me is Midgley's unwillingness to own his own behavior. He was smug as can be over his verbal assault on Sandra Tanner in her bookstore. I'm sure he felt "proud" of similar confrontations with Rod Meldrum, and that emeritus GA that he attacked. Plus, this is the guy who was alleged to be screaming *obscenities* at the Lynne Whitesides vigil! Why doesn't he just own the fact that he's an obvious scumbag?
"[I]f, while hoping that everybody else will be honest and so forth, I can personally prosper through unethical and immoral acts without being detected and without risk, why should I not?." --Daniel Peterson, 6/4/14

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Dr LOD »

Well, I will right now remind Dr. Shades of the one who has been, from my personal perspective, the most confused, dishonest and disgusting of the lot. I have in mind one who claims to be a real MD, and who who posts his rubbish as Dr. LOD on your hate Board, which he joined in August 2019. I can even give you the exact date and time of the day, if that will help refresh your memory.

Dr. LOD recently posted on the Kiwi Mormon blog under the name Dr. Velho Burrinho. You must know that this is Dr. LOD. Why? Because I explained on that blog that Dr. Velho Burrinho which means Little Old Donkey, since "velho" means "old" and Burrinho (or "burro") means Donkey (or Ass, if one goes back to the Latin for that animal). Hence your own Dr. LOD began on your hate board in August, and then in October started making all kinds of really stupid, false and insulting comments about by scholarship on the faith of Maori Latter-day Saints on sic et non. This went on day after day for months until Professor Peterson finally gave the Little Old Donkey the boot.

And you must remember that you asked me provide you access to my essays and reviews that deal with the faith of Maori Latter-day Saints. You indicated that you wanted to read what I have published on this topic. Did you read any of those nine items? Do you think that I made up out of thin air what I have set out about the faith of Maori Saints, and then have tried to force them to believe what Dr. LOD insists are my lies? If you know that this is not true, then you know that the Little Old Donkey is a bloody crackpot.
It is interesting how he is fixated on the donkey thing, on a post that describes the dehumanization of individuals.

The Professor really isn't showing thate is as educated or smart as he pretends to be. He has yet been able to engage me on the debate point that his relationship to the Maori (as well as the LDS relationship to "Lamanite" peoples) at its center is one of cultural appropriation, and racist thinking. Instead he is reduced to pecking out insults, bullying and trying to dox individuals. While hiding behind the guise of being a saint.

His transoceanic stalking of Gina Colvin is a symptom of the same shortcoming. Professor Midgley cannot engage her on a scholarly level, and has been left using petty character insults, and trying to arrange a confrontation in a house of worship where he could confront her on his terms.

In the immortal words of Professor Phillip Jenkins, in the epic back and forth debate with the late Professor William Hamblin said:
Scholarship is what scholars do, and if they don’t do it, it’s not scholarship.
https://www.patheos.com/blogs/anxiousbe ... onoclasts/
To his credit Hamblin did act in a scholarly manner in this debate. Very much unlike the behavior and tactics of Professor Midgley.

Now watch for the empty complaining post coming from Sic et Non on this.

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Re: Rules of Patheos: Midgley appears to violate TOS 10x

Post by Lemmie »


Louis Midgley Dr. Shades 18 hours ago

As far as I remember I have glanced at one item no more than three times that the very innocent Dr. Shades has maintained on his hate site for years about me and only then when a friend called my attention to some really disgusting that had been added to that very long thread. The other day I figured out how to access the Dr. Shades hate site and had a bit of a look around....
same comment, the VERY NEXT paragraph:
...And I doubt tha[t] others who enjoy Dan's blog have ever had a peek at the Dr. Shades hate and misinformation board.

I certainly have not done so.


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Louis Midgley

http://disq.us/p/2a01qvs
Midgley, pay attention! When telling a lie, don’t elaborate! You are sinking your own ship!

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