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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:38 am 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
Albion, you don't really understand the Bible. This last apostasy was the "GREAT falling away" as prophesied, and it required a "restitution of all things" also as prophesied! This apostasy was not due to a failure by God, but a failure by man! The Bible also prophesies of God's ultimate victory, but that doesn't occur until Satan and his followers are cast out at the end of the millennium! Albion, you are still stuck on step one! Salvation is not an event; it is a process! "Straight is the gate and narrow is the way" (or path). In addition to faith, CHRIST STATES: one must "keep the commandments" and "endure to the end"!!! Otherwise, you may find yourself as one of those saying "Lord, Lord, haven't we walked down the isle for you?" And, you may find yourself in the first heaven (or lowest glory in the resurrection)!


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 7:25 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
Lots of references in there, gdemetz...do you want to quote references and substantiate your points. I did check The Interpreter's Bible yesterday, a whole set, and could not find the reference you gave earlier. Can you provide volume number and page number?


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2012 7:21 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
Albion, what specific reference do you mean? I quoted The Interpreters Bible before in regard to baptism for the dead. It lists the verses by Biblical order, so you can find that one looking at their commentary for 1 Corinthians 15:29. If you want another reference, just tell me concerning which point I made.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:49 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
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I want you to give the specific verses that you are referring to when you talk of a total apostasy and a "restitution" so that we can look at them in context


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 Post subject: Re: Why do LDS dismiss the greater part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 2:17 pm 
God

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:49 am
Posts: 2407
bcspace wrote:
Quote:
There was no first century belief in eternal marriage.


Sure there was. 1 Cor 11:11, 1 Peter 3:7, etc. etc.


I looked these two verses up. Both deal with living in the LORD and have nothing to say concerning the afterlife of believers. I digress, sorry, it just seems that this point was not mentioned.


Last edited by LittleNipper on Wed Jun 06, 2012 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 5:22 pm 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
As you point out there are no scriptural verses that support the Mormn concept of eternal marriage....only scriptures that Mormons extend out of context to support their belief.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 8:36 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
Are you still here, Albion? You haven't given up yet? You really need that English comprehension course! Once again, the scriptures plainly and clearly state that the husbands and wives become "heirs TOGETHER of the grace of life"! If this were an MMA match, I know that you would never tap out, but the referee would have stopped it long ago!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:12 pm 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
gedfemtz, Ill match my use and understanding of English against yours any day but that is not really the issue except for your continuing personal attacks. Please go back and reread the verse you are using "...heirs together of the GRACE OF LIFE..." You are putting emphasis in the "together" to show something that isn't there. It is talking about LIFE. Not only the life lived but THE life provided by trust and faith in Christ. You fail completely in drawing any inference from it to eternal marriage. It isn't mentioned...it isn't there. I know you desperately want it to say what you claim but it just doesn't.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2012 9:22 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
Albion, you are as spiritually blind as a bat is physically blind! The heirs together means that they will inherit eternal life together (What in the heck do you think the binding meant?!?) as, of course, husband and wife! This teaching is the reason the Saduccees ask Christ the question about marriage in the first place! Sometimes when you read something you also need to use common sense! However, I don't expect that from you; after all, if you read "You are gods." and then say it doesn't mean, "You are gods," then I'm not getting my hopes up!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:38 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
I suppose it is too much to expect you to read the whole chapter for context and thus place verse 7 within that context, gdemetz. Peter wrote this epistle in anticipation of potential persecution of believers from Rome (possibly as a result of repercussions from the burning of Rome which Emperor Nero blamed on Christians). Peter begins with a greeting in the name of the Trinity and continues with a reminder that all events are within God's foreknowledge and they can be assured of God's protection no matter what may come. Verse 3 emphasises the special place Christ's people hold even though they may suffer as Jesus did and that life is a blessing through God's grace and that marriage is a part of the blessing of life. Husbands and wives, through marriage, have inherited a special life blessing because of that grace. You have accused me of all kinds of things in your personal insults, gdemetz, including an inability to to read what is on the page. I have responded that it is the reading of verses in context which aids their meaning. Pot and kettle come to mind as you clearly ignore not only the context but the actual words of the verse which are self evident....."...heirs together of the grace of LIFE"....life itself is a manifestation of God's grace and marriage affords a special inheritance of that grace.

I have nothing more to say on this verse, gdemetz, but I do challenge you to show me one Biblical verse that uses the term "eternal marriage". Yes or no, is the term used anywhere in the Bible? I won't hold my breath waiting for a one word answer.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Thu Jun 07, 2012 10:24 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
Hello Albion,?! A key word there that you need to consider is HEIRS!!! An heir is one who inherits something! What do the husband and wife inherit together? Eternal life together!!! It is commonly accepted by almost all, even in apostate Christendom, that there is no death after the resurrection! Therefore, that makes it eternal! However, I don't have my hopes up that you will be able to grasp this! After all, if "You are gods" does not mean "You are gods" to you, then what hope is there? Why do you suppose the Saduccess ask the question about marriage to Christ? THINK! What do you suppose the bindings in heaven meant? THINK!!!

"Neither is the man without the woman or the woman without the man in the Lord."

Consider that also, Albion!!! Do you think when they get to heaven that that will change, and that God will say that that no longer applies now? THINK!!!!!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 2:58 am 
God

Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 3:52 am
Posts: 7306
gdemetz wrote:
Hello Albion,?! A key word there that you need to consider is HEIRS!!! An heir is one who inherits something! What do the husband and wife inherit together? Eternal life together!!! It is commonly accepted by almost all, even in apostate Christendom, that there is no death after the resurrection! Therefore, that makes it eternal! However, I don't have my hopes up that you will be able to grasp this! After all, if "You are gods" does not mean "You are gods" to you, then what hope is there? Why do you suppose the Saduccess ask the question about marriage to Christ? THINK! What do you suppose the bindings in heaven meant? THINK!!!

"Neither is the man without the woman or the woman without the man in the Lord."

Consider that also, Albion!!! Do you think when they get to heaven that that will change, and that God will say that that no longer applies now? THINK!!!!!!!


Well do you still believe God will only allow black people to be servants in heaven or has God changed his mind on that one? If He has then presumably the door is open for Him to change His mind on just about anything, including turning round and saying "that no longer applies".

_________________
“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.”
Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric

"One, two, three...let's go shopping!"
Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 7:24 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
Drifting, whether or not God changes his mind is another issue. gdemetz and Mormons in general are guilty of assuming additions to scripture that are not there, as he does here. gedemetz has no desire to read the epistle in its entirety but seizes one verse and somehow extrapolates from that a support for a doctrine that is there only in the nefarious mind of Joseph Smith. What I "think" will happen in heaven has no relevance to the word as printed. .


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:26 pm 
God

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:49 am
Posts: 2407
I see no reason for eternal marriage, where eternity is all about the CHURCH being "married" to Christ and not about a couple being married to each other...


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:06 pm 
God

Joined: Sun Jun 26, 2011 4:41 pm
Posts: 2361
hatersinmyward wrote:
The LDS claim to be christian, however they don't teach or discuss anything other than The Gospels, Acts and Revelations to their members.


Complete lie.... Thou shalt not bear false witness.

Quote:
It seems to me they cannot keep the New Testament in context and have it correlate with Joseph Smith's teachings.


I spent years in multiple religions seeing clearly how not a single one fully and accurately fit what the Bible actually said and in full said. Only when I came upon the LDS Church did a religion fully and accurately fit the book.

You are ignorant.

Quote:
In order to justify those doctrinal errors they say that part of the Bible was translated improperly. If and when anything is taught out of the books I've not previously mentioned the stories are butchered or taught out of context.


Another lie. Mormons and Mormonism accepts everything in the scriptures.
While there have been scribal and translation errors, the Gospel itself is intact as long as it's translated correctly. The "translation" spoken of is primarily "interpretation" by men, that is the actual problem, not the book themselves. However, modern translations are corrupting the Word even more in many cases, such as the NIV.

Quote:
I was never taught anything in LDS classes having to do with the Disciples preaching the gospel after Christ's Crucifixion or the Disciples own hardships or deaths.


You are clearly ignorant and simply don't know at all what you are talking about.
Your ignorant "box" is not the entire Church and it's teachings, and people. The Church as any religion teaches lessons from the NT, and it's people and teachers read the NT themselves. Further, since Mormonism is a "lay-ministry", that gives the majority of those in it to know the scriptures and the religion for THEMSELVES, and not be brainwashed by some preacher, religion, etc.

We are not afraid of other religions, but other religions are afraid of us.
Thus, who is really the ignorant and brainwashed, not following the NT???

And just to give you one of many examples of other religions not following the NT.
Christ made clear in Mark 9 & Luke 9 that NO FOLLOWER of His is to condemn other believers, even though they are not with you, and are as little children to you, and without your authority and truth. Yet, people like you degrade the Mormons Faith in Christ and His Work and Glory.

One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism doesn't come by hate of other believers.....


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2012 10:22 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
I am presently working on my own version of the Bible in spiritual braille for the spiritually blind. It will be a long time before it is finished, but here are some of the quotes:

"the husband and wife become heirs together, with their resurrected bodies, of eternal life in the highest heaven"

"neither is the man without the woman or the woman without the man, in this life or the next, in the Lord"

"neglect not the gift of the presberty, or the priesthood which was given to you by the spirit of prophesy and by the laying on of hands"

"you are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood" (needed no clarification, except for Albion)

"I will give unto you thew keys of the kingdom of heaven so that anything yoiu bind on earth, including marriage, will be bound in heaven"

You are gods and all of you are the children of the Most High" (needed no clarification, except for Albion)


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:29 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
ldsfaqs...why is it that virtually all the Mormons debating here use personal insults, berating the intelligence and comprehension of those who disagree with them ? Gdemetz is a master at this. Do you think it adds weight to your position or is it some kind of device to cover your own inadequacies? I really would like to understand this.

Just one point on your post. Christians, and by extension, their churches do not fear the Mormon Church. They do, however, fear for the salvation of Mormons who have placed their eternal destiny in Joseph Smith and his false teachings. "...the majority of those in it (Mormonism) ...know the religion for themselves, and are not brainwashed by some preacher, religion, etc." Now I know you didn't mean it to be humorous but this statement coming from the lock-step and cultic position of Mormonism truly is amusing.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 8:37 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
Oh, gdemetz, a version that adds all the things Mormons wish were there and presume are there. What a great idea....too bad that Joseph Smith beat you to it with his version (I won't use the word translation since that would add dignity to his effort). Likely if you did get it done it would make your scholarship a laughing stock pretty much as it did for Smith which is the real reason why the Mormon Church doesn't want to use it.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2012 6:36 pm 
God

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 10:49 am
Posts: 2407
A curse on anyone who adds or takes from what GOD has inspired and protects ---- His Holy Word.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2012 10:26 pm 
God

Joined: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:59 am
Posts: 1681
No Albion, just a little common sense would do! You always try to wiggle out of what the scriptures are trying to clearly teach just like you did with the "Ye are gods!" You tried to say that it just meant that they were acting like gods, how dumb! It's your comprehension again, Albion! If that was really meant, then why was the added phrase; "and all of you are the children of the Most High?!? IN other words, the ultra dumb evangelical version should read: "Ya'all actin' like them there gods, but all of ya'all is the chillin' of the Most High." Is that right, Albion? Is that what you are trying to say?!?


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 Post subject: Re: Why Do LDS Dismiss the Greater Part of the New Testament
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:53 am 
God

Joined: Mon May 07, 2012 2:43 pm
Posts: 1390
I'll let gdemetz's last post speak for itself.


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