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 Post subject: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:30 am 
Sunbeam

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May I propose a prize, or at least a recognition to those who seem to trip over or hang up on some of the minor issues in this church? It could be an actual physical thing, such as a small bit of window screening. We could call it "The gnat-strainer Prize" (Matt. 23: 24), for those who let their faith be shaken by such trivia as Joseph Smith peeping into a stone in a hat, or President Uchtdorf claiming Guatemalans are children of Lehi. To save "Mormon Discussions" the trouble and expense of postage, we could just keep these bits of screen at your office, and those awarded the prize could drop by and pick them up. I'm sure they have lots of spare time on their hands. And, you know, you gotta think; did Christ use that metaphor because He knew there would be "gnats" arising, at least in the immature minds of those wrestling with the complexities of an eternal gospel?


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:32 am 
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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:35 am 
God

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LOL!

Please can you provide a list of issues you consider non gnat-straining?

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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:37 am 
God
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I would like to nominate Why Me's attempt to argue the "face just above the hat" vs "face in the hat" description for this prestigious award.

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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:42 am 
God
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Drifting wrote:
LOL!

Please can you provide a list of issues you consider non gnat-straining?


I concur. We need a list of what are "minor" and major issues.

I would say that racism, sexism and unhealthy teachings on sexuality are major issues.

I would say that how many earrings a person wears and tattoo's are a minor issue.

What say you?

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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:53 am 
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Major issues are Joseph Smith's polygamy, blood atonement, racial folklore, unhealthy teaching on sexuality, and Book of Abraham. Once a person gets bitter and decides they hate the church then they might have a tendancy to start straining at gnats just for entertainment but those are not the real issues in their minds.


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 11:59 am 
God
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Zelder wrote:
Major issues are Joseph Smith's polygamy, blood atonement, racial folklore, unhealthy teaching on sexuality, and Book of Abraham. Once a person gets bitter and decides they hate the church then they might have a tendancy to start straining at gnats just for entertainment but those are not the real issues in their minds.


I think this is pretty accurate, although I would throw out the word "bitter" and "hate." What also happens (in my mind anyway) is that some people go through a systematic breaking down of their belief system. So, whenever they come across another element to dissect it is one more straw on the camel's back, so to speak.

Death by a thousand cuts.

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And if pigs flew we wouldn't usually eat pork.~ldsfaqs


~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:02 pm 
God

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Is the Church's treatment of its own history and controversies helpful in overcoming gnat straining or does the whitewashing and obfuscation actually propagate it amongst members with questions?

For example. Members who 'gnat strain' on the subject of how the Church uses funds could be helped in overcoming this problem by simply publishing the facts. The fact that they don't encourages people to question why they don't.

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“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.”
Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric

"One, two, three...let's go shopping!"
Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:09 pm 
Deacon
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just me wrote:
I think this is pretty accurate, although I would throw out the word "bitter" and "hate." What also happens (in my mind anyway) is that some people go through a systematic breaking down of their belief system. So, whenever they come across another element to dissect it is one more straw on the camel's back, so to speak.

Death by a thousand cuts.


That makes sense.


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:14 pm 
God
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I would like to nominate myself for this award for straining at the gnat of why it is that lengthy passages of the King James Version of the New Testament appear in the Book of Mormon.

This gnat is only slightly larger than the gnat of why lengthy passages of the King James Version of the Old Testament appear in the Book of Mormon.

In fact, this gnat is so big, it is approaching the size of an elephant.

An elephant that has taken up residence in the living room.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri

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You prove yourself of the devil and anti-mormon every word you utter, because only the devil perverts facts to make their case.--ldsfaqs (6-24-13)


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:17 pm 
God

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consiglieri wrote:
I would like to nominate myself for this award for straining at the gnat of why it is that lengthy passages of the King James Version of the New Testament appear in the Book of Mormon.

This gnat is only slightly larger than the gnat of why lengthy passages of the King James Version of the Old Testament appear in the Book of Mormon.

In fact, this gnat is so big, it is approaching the size of an elephant.

An elephant that has taken up residence in the living room.

All the Best!

--Consiglieri


Then there's that deutero Isaiah gnat buzzing around...bzz...bzz...bzz...

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“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.”
Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric

"One, two, three...let's go shopping!"
Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:27 pm 
God
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Would the relationship of the KEP to the Book of Abraham be a minor issue or major issue? I mean as in comparison to the scroll translation problems themselves.

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The Law of the land and the rules of the church do not allow one man to have more than one wife alive at once.
John Taylor, husband of 3 wives, 15 Nov 1844

"I consider them Christian not because of the church they go to on Sunday, but because of how they treat their fellow human beings." Ceeboo


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 12:30 pm 
God
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Location: Somewhere between bemused and curious.
Would the attempt to distinguish between Joseph's Smith secular translations and sacred translations be a major issue or a minor one?

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The Law of the land and the rules of the church do not allow one man to have more than one wife alive at once.
John Taylor, husband of 3 wives, 15 Nov 1844

"I consider them Christian not because of the church they go to on Sunday, but because of how they treat their fellow human beings." Ceeboo


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 1:31 pm 
God

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Fence Sitter wrote:
I would like to nominate Why Me's attempt to argue the "face just above the hat" vs "face in the hat" description for this prestigious award.


+1

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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:51 pm 
Sunbeam

Joined: Fri Dec 09, 2011 11:47 am
Posts: 49
OK, I'm the bozo who suggested the "gnat strainer" award. Gotta admit it does my ego good. In any event, to paraphrase Joseph Smith (on gnats vs. camels; my interpretation and application, not his): "Jesus Christ and His atonement and resurrection are the only important things in our religion. All other things are appendages to the gospel." The original quote was much better, and definitive, but darned if I know where it is.


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 2:56 pm 
God

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logjamislds wrote:
OK, I'm the bozo who suggested the "gnat strainer" award. Gotta admit it does my ego good. In any event, to paraphrase Joseph Smith (on gnats vs. camels; my interpretation and application, not his): "Jesus Christ and His atonement and resurrection are the only important things in our religion. All other things are appendages to the gospel." The original quote was much better, and definitive, but darned if I know where it is.


So the followings must, therefore, be unimportant in our religion:
Tithing
Word of Wisdom
Priesthood
Home Teaching
God
Joseph Smith
The Prophet
Temple ordinances
Three of the four years of Seminary study
Etc
Etc

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“We look to not only the spiritual but also the temporal, and we believe that a person who is impoverished temporally cannot blossom spiritually.”
Keith McMullin - Counsellor in Presiding Bishopric

"One, two, three...let's go shopping!"
Thomas S Monson - Prophet, Seer, Revelator


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:00 pm 
God
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logjamislds wrote:
OK, I'm the bozo who suggested the "gnat strainer" award. Gotta admit it does my ego good. In any event, to paraphrase Joseph Smith (on gnats vs. camels; my interpretation and application, not his): "Jesus Christ and His atonement and resurrection are the only important things in our religion. All other things are appendages to the gospel." The original quote was much better, and definitive, but darned if I know where it is.


For being the most important part, it seems to have been unemphasized until quite recently.

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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:00 pm 
God
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logjamislds wrote:
OK, I'm the bozo who suggested the "gnat strainer" award. Gotta admit it does my ego good. In any event, to paraphrase Joseph Smith (on gnats vs. camels; my interpretation and application, not his): "Jesus Christ and His atonement and resurrection are the only important things in our religion. All other things are appendages to the gospel." The original quote was much better, and definitive, but darned if I know where it is.


What is interesting is that I would never think that my appendages were unimportant. Without my arms I couldn't type this to you.

The appendages of the gospel are what make the LDS church the LDS church. And the LDS church claims to be led by Christ himself and be the One True and Living Church on the earth.

Sounds like the gnats are actually pretty important.

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And if pigs flew we wouldn't usually eat pork.~ldsfaqs


~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:51 pm 
God
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just me wrote:
Sounds like the gnats are actually pretty important.


The gnats have devoured the camel.

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You prove yourself of the devil and anti-mormon every word you utter, because only the devil perverts facts to make their case.--ldsfaqs (6-24-13)


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 3:57 pm 
God
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consiglieri wrote:
just me wrote:
Sounds like the gnats are actually pretty important.


The gnats have devoured the camel.


OMG! BWAHAHAHAHAHA! Lovely visual.

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not all facts are even facts~ldsfaqs
And if pigs flew we wouldn't usually eat pork.~ldsfaqs


~Those who benefit from the status quo always attribute inequities to the choices of the underdog.~Ann Crittenden
~The Goddess is not separate from the world-She is the world and all things in it.~


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 Post subject: Re: The gnat-strainer prize.
PostPosted: Tue Jan 03, 2012 9:18 pm 
Dark Lord of the Sith
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logjamislds wrote:
OK, I'm the bozo who suggested the "gnat strainer" award. Gotta admit it does my ego good. In any event, to paraphrase Joseph Smith (on gnats vs. camels; my interpretation and application, not his): "Jesus Christ and His atonement and resurrection are the only important things in our religion. All other things are appendages to the gospel." The original quote was much better, and definitive, but darned if I know where it is.


Thus, since anything extraneous to that would be a "gnat," it can be discarded, making Mormonism in general and the LDS Church in particular entirely superfluous and unnecessary.

In other words, those who are believing Latter-day Saints are swallowing a camel. Those who no longer trouble themselves with all of the "appendages"---that being everything distinctive about the LDS Church---are more focused on what really matters and therefore closer to Christ.

Well done, logjamislds.

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