The Tyrannical Minority

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EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

Chris Cillizza is really, really bad Honor:

https://twitter.com/CillizzaCNN/status/ ... 2101045248

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honorentheos
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by honorentheos »

A bunch of adults yelling at one another over matters that almost no one watching understood or cares about.

While probably accurate in portraying how many saw today's hearing, yeah, it's irresponsible journalism. Fair point.
The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
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EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

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honorentheos wrote:A bunch of adults yelling at one another over matters that almost no one watching understood or cares about.

While probably accurate in portraying how many saw today's hearing, yeah, it's irresponsible journalism. Fair point.


The bigger problem is journalists feeding these narratives lead the public to taking that attitude, much in the same way that people like Cillizza covering Clinton's emails as a massive scandal had a major impact on public attitudes towards it.

Cillizza, seemingly unaware what his job is here, could try to get over his confusion and boredom and report relevant facts in context.

EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

Honor -

The media can't both sides Ukraine! It's too clear. Let's focus on that simple, easily digestible malfeasance for the sake of the public.

New York Times: Hold my beer.

https://twitter.com/hshaban/status/1204254100076011521

EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

Politico is reporting that a few moderate Democrats are floating trying to back out of impeachment for a lesser form of response:

https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/1 ... ent-080311

It's hard to get my head around what atrocious, cowardly instincts these people have even before realizing they have a lot of power over the party's agenda.

At a certain point, you have to realize that hitching yourself to these people is itself a form of surrender and you're better off just directing your effort to making sure they don't get elected. You're into some very tough choices on short vs. long-term strategy at that point.

My best theory for these people is this:

A lot of them are in Trump-friendly swing districts and have just inane ideas about what best promotes their precarious election chances. They won in 2018 because midterm elections are generally good for the party opposite the Presidential incumbent with the popularity of the Presidential incumbent going a long way to determining how strong their advantage is. A rising tide lifts all boats, and Trump's unpopularity in a mid-term was sufficient to tilt swing and light red districts into their column. You can predict the final 2018 House results almost entirely by just looking at a few generic numbers without getting into the dynamics of specific races.

Presidential elections where there is an incumbent have a lot to do with the popularity of the Presidential incumbent. They also now have very strong coattail effects for down-ballot races in the House. The single most important factor on whether these Democrats are reelected is going to be how popular Trump is and/or how much illicit election interference he and his boosters can get away with.

Their behavior is about as ill-conceived as possible for driving Trump's numbers down. They are obsessed with their next election chances, but adopt a terrible strategy for maximizing their chances. Why?

Well, one idea I have is that these are people who ran election campaigns where they had to make countless decisions about what to say and do under the belief that those choices were meaningful for determining if they would win. They had consultants giving them advice on what to say and do to win. And they did it. And they won. This may be giving them a mistaken impression that what they were saying and doing - largely campaigning on solving specific issues and a sense of bipartisan cooperation - is what they need to do to win. This is so god damn dumb, but the election process might select people who think that way. It's amusing when you contrast against Republicans, a party filled top to bottom with people who believe the Earth is a few thousand years old, managing to understand how nationalized politics works at a basic level.

That might be totally wrong, though. Whatever is going on, it's unacceptable. They're people obsessed with appearing that they care about doing the right thing over political maneuvering by engaging in awful political maneuvering in lieu of doing the right thing.

EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

Donald Trump's political instincts are also terrible:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/12/10/politics ... index.html

Mitch McConnell has kicked Democrats' teeth in with a minority of public backing for the majority of his time in office. Maybe he knows what he's doing there, Trump?

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honorentheos
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by honorentheos »

EAllusion wrote:Honor -

The media can't both sides Ukraine! It's too clear. Let's focus on that simple, easily digestible malfeasance for the sake of the public.

New York Times: Hold my beer.

https://twitter.com/hshaban/status/1204254100076011521

I thought we'd moved past these one-man plays.

Again, the argument was that the Ukraine scandal had multiple benefits for being the focus of the investigation, not least of which being the fact it was the Ukraine that was the injured party even though the target was Joe Biden. That allowed witnesses to come forward who crossed the line of party affiliation out of a sense of concern for the damage it was doing in our diplomatic mission in Eastern Europe. Should it have been more easily digestible? Sure. Did I hope the Democrat leadership was better prepared to make a simple case to the American people than they ended up making? Yeah. I think they chose the wrong target audience, playing to people who already were on board with impeachment in their choices for lines of questioning, witness selection, and what they chose to stress during the public inquiry. They should have instead been asking how they could reach independent voters in swing states who might not see the issue the same way the Democrat base does and tried to make the case specifically to them. They did a terrible job. And it was what I was concerned about going back to the aftermath of the Mueller report. So.

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The world is always full of the sound of waves..but who knows the heart of the sea, a hundred feet down? Who knows it's depth?
~ Eiji Yoshikawa

EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

honorentheos wrote:Again, the argument was that the Ukraine scandal had multiple benefits for being the focus of the investigation, not least of which being the fact it was the Ukraine that was the injured party even though the target was Joe Biden. That allowed witnesses to come forward who crossed the line of party affiliation out of a sense of concern for the damage it was doing in our diplomatic mission in Eastern Europe. Should it have been more easily digestible? Sure. Did I hope the Democrat leadership was better prepared to make a simple case to the American people than they ended up making? Yeah. I think they chose the wrong target audience, playing to people who already were on board with impeachment in their choices for lines of questioning, witness selection, and what they chose to stress during the public inquiry. They should have instead been asking how they could reach independent voters in swing states who might not see the issue the same way the Democrat base does and tried to make the case specifically to them. They did a terrible job. And it was what I was concerned about going back to the aftermath of the Mueller report. So.

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Democrats certainly tried their hardest to make a simple case, but that's hard to do in the face of a sophisticated disinformation campaign that takes some explaining to clear up. It was naïve to believe that anything, literally anything, could be reduced into a simple case. Even something as simple as Trump releasing a summary that includes a confession of an impeachable offense right on it, then going on TV to repeat the impeachable offense.

There is literally nothing the Democrats could do that will knock legacy media writers like the above off the narrative of, "Democrats say X, but Republicans say Y" when it is a negative story for Republicans. Shouty lying or the truth? Who is to say? Politics is a choose your own adventure. You can't pierce that narrative on any one story to those low information swing voters in swing states. Until such a time that this widespread journalistic ethic is purged, that's the reality Democrats should understand they inhabit.

The press can, however, be compelled to cover bad stories for Republicans over and over and over if Republicans are just going to keep on their path. And those low information swinger voters in swing states can least remember that Republicans sure do sound corrupt even if they trip up on the specifics. Republicans ground Hillary Clinton down with this strategy with mostly lies and innuendo. Democrats probably could pull it off in Trump's case with the truth.

EAllusion
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Re: The Tyrannical Minority

Post by EAllusion »

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/ENoVCjQUUAAMCGR.jpg

Chris Cillizza is an idiot whose large media platform is a toxic influence on our society, pt. 8093.

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