Mittens wrote: Maksutov wrote:
You seem continually surprised by the fact that Mormons are different.
You do realize that there is a lot of variation among "Christians", right? Their churches are different, songs are different, Bible readings are different, theologies are different. Really, it's what you would expect from human cultural products.
Theology core is basic
E. Calvin Beisner
God in Three Persons
The Christian Church throughout history has found in order to remain faithful to the teachings of the New Testament regarding the person and work of Christ, it had to affirm at least the following doctrines:
The doctrine of the Trinity----that in the nature of the One True God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, each fully God, Coequal and Coeternal
The doctrine of the incarnation----- that the Son of God, the Word ( John 1:1 ) became man ( John ; Rom. 1:3 ) uniting in the single person of the Son two distinct and complete natures, diety and humanity.
The sinless of Christ---- that he lived as the perfect man to fulfill God’s plan for all humanity. ( Heb 2:6-18; 4:14, 15 )
The sacrificial death of Christ---- to atone for sins of all men ( 1 John 2:2; 1 Peter 2:; Matt 20:28; 1 Cor 6:20 )
The resurrection of Christ---- that after his death, Christ rose bodily from the grave, showing his triumph over sin and death, as the first fruit, and hence the promise, of resurrection to all who have faith in him ( 1 ; Rom 6:3-11 )
Salvation by Grace through Faith--- that justification before God, and hence salvation from punishment and life with God, are available only as a gift from God through faith in Jesus Christ ( John 14:6; 3:16 Acts 4:10; John 8:24 ) pp 19-20
When we have said these three things, then—that there is but one God, that the Father and the Son and the Spirit is each a distinct person—we have enunciated the doctrine of the Trinity in its completeness.
We may condense this into a somewhat shorter statement, one which is more precise: In the nature of the God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit ( or substance ) of the one true God, there are three distinct persons, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit p 24
“The Nicene Creed, then, with centuries of theological discussion and controversy behind it, still teaches of the Trinity as the New Testament does: that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit, while distinct from each other personally, are the same God” p 153
That's one guy and one faction. Sorry, dude, Christianity is a lot bigger than that. I know you guys like to fight over your market share but you're inventing differences.
I love it when y'all accuse eachother of heresy--it just shows it's humans fighting over human ideas. If there were really a God or a Jesus, they could end all this squabbling. But there isn't and they haven't and here you are. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nontrinitarianism
Various views exist regarding the relationships between the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
Those who believe that Jesus is not God, nor absolutely equal to God, but was either God's subordinate Son, a messenger from God, or prophet, or the perfect created human:
Adoptionism (2nd century AD) holds that Jesus became divine at his baptism (sometimes associated with the Gospel of Mark) or at his resurrection (sometimes associated with Saint Paul and Shepherd of Hermas);
Arianism – Arius (AD c. 250 or 256–336) believed that the pre-existent Son of God was directly created by the Father, before all ages, and that he was subordinate to God the Father. Arius' position was that the Son was brought forth as the very first of God's creations, and that the Father later created all things through the Son. Arius taught that in the creation of the universe, the Father was the ultimate creator, supplying all the materials and directing the design, while the Son worked the materials, making all things at the bidding and in the service of the Father, by which "through [Christ] all things came into existence". Arianism became the dominant view in some regions in the time of the Roman Empire, notably the Visigoths until 589. The Third Council of Sirmium in 357 was the high point of Arianism. The Seventh Arian Confession (Second Sirmium Confession) held that both homoousios (of one substance) and homoiousios (of similar substance) were unbiblical and that the Father is greater than the Son (this confession was later known as the Blasphemy of Sirmium): "But since many persons are disturbed by questions concerning what is called in Latin substantia, but in Greek ousia, that is, to make it understood more exactly, as to 'coessential,' or what is called, 'like-in-essence,' there ought to be no mention of any of these at all, nor exposition of them in the Church, for this reason and for this consideration, that in divine Scripture nothing is written about them, and that they are above men's knowledge and above men's understanding";
Psilanthropism – Ebionites (1st to 4th centuries AD) observed Jewish law, denied the virgin birth and regarded Jesus as a prophet only;
Socinianism – Photinus taught that Jesus was the sinless Messiah and redeemer, and the only perfect human son of God, but that he had no pre-human existence. They interpret verses such as John 1:1 to refer to God's "plan" existing in God's mind before Christ's birth;
Unitarianism views Jesus as the son of God, subordinate and distinct from his Father;
Many Gnostic traditions held that the Christ is a heavenly Aeon but not one with the Father.
Those who believe that the Father, the resurrected Son and the Holy Spirit are different aspects of one God, as perceived by the believer, rather than three distinct persons:
Modalism – Sabellius (fl. c. 215) stated that God took numerous forms in both the Hebrew and the Christian Greek Scriptures, and that God has manifested himself in three primary modes regarding the salvation of mankind. He contended that "Father, Son, and Spirit" were different roles played by the same divine person in various circumstances in history; thus God is Father in creation (God created a Son through the virgin birth), Son in redemption (God manifested himself as Jesus for the purpose of his death upon the cross), and Holy Spirit in regeneration (God's Spirit within the Son and within the souls of Christian believers). In this view, God is not three distinct persons, but rather one person manifesting himself in multiple ways. Trinitarians condemn this view as a heresy. The chief critic of Sabellianism was Tertullian, who labeled the movement "Patripassianism", from the Latin words pater for "father", and passus from the verb "to suffer", because it implied that the Father suffered on the cross. It was coined by Tertullian in his work Adversus Praxeas, Chapter I: "By this Praxeas did a twofold service for the devil at Rome: he drove away prophecy, and he brought in heresy; he put to flight the Paraclete, and he crucified the Father." The term homoousion (ὁμοούσιον, literally same being) later adopted by the Trinitarian Nicene Council for its anti-Arian creed had previously been used by Sabellians.
Those who believe that Jesus Christ is Almighty God, but that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are actually three distinct almighty "Gods" with distinct natures, acting as one divine group, united in purpose:
Tri-theism – John Philoponus, an Aristotelian and monophysite in Alexandria, in the middle of the 6th century, saw in the Trinity three separate natures, substances and deities, according to the number of divine persons. He sought to justify this view by the Aristotelian categories of genus, species and individuum. In the Middle Ages, Roscellin of Compiegne, the founder of Nominalism, argued for three distinct almighty Gods, with three distinct natures, who were one in purpose, acting together as one divine group or godhead. He said, though, like Philoponus, that unless the three persons are tres res (three things with distinct natures), the whole Trinity must have been incarnate. And therefore, since only the Logos was made flesh, the other two persons must have had distinct "natures", separate from the Logos, and so had to be separate and distinct Gods, though all three were one in divine work and plan. In this view, they would be considered "three Gods in one". This notion was condemned by St. Anselm.
Those who believe that the Holy Spirit is not a person:
Binitarianism – Adherents include those people through history who believed that God is only two co-equal and co-eternal persons, the Father and the Word, not three. They taught that the Holy Spirit is not a distinct person, but is the power or divine influence of the Father and Son, emanating out to the universe, in creation, and to believers;
Marcionism – Marcion (AD c. 110–160) believed there were two deities, one of creation and judgment (in the Hebrew Bible) and one of redemption and mercy (in the New Testament).
Modern Christian groups
Christadelphians hold that Jesus is the actual son of God, the Father; and that Jesus was fully an actual human (and needed to be so in order to save humans from their sins). The "holy spirit" terminology in the Bible is interpreted as referring to God's power, or God's character/mind (depending on the context).
Church of God General Conference (Abrahamic Faith).
The Cooneyites is a Christian sect that split from the Two by Twos in 1928 following Edward Cooney's excommunication from the main group; they deny the Living Witness Doctrine.[clarification needed]
Iglesia ni Cristo (Tagalog for Church of Christ) views Jesus as human but endowed by God with attributes not found in ordinary humans, though lacking attributes found in God. They contend that it is God's will to worship Jesus. INC rejects the Trinity as heresy, adopting a version of unitarianism.
Jehovah's Witnesses and other Bible Student movement groups such as the Associated Bible Students) teach that God the Father is uniquely Almighty God. They consider Jesus to be "the First-begotten Son", God's only direct creation, and the very first creation by God. They give relative "worship" or "obeisance" (in the sense of homage, as to a king) to Christ, pray through him as God's only high priest, consider him to be their mediator and Messiah. They believe that only the Father is without beginning, that the Father is greater than the Son in all things, and that only the Father is worthy of "sacred service" (latria). They believe that the Son had a beginning, and was brought forth at a certain point, as "the firstborn of all creation" and "the only-begotten", that he left heaven to be born as a perfect human, as the Jewish Messiah and Redeemer, and that after his ascension to heaven he resumed his pre-human identity. They do not believe that the Holy Spirit is an actual person, but consider it to be God's divine active force.
The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, informally known as the LDS Church, teaches that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit are distinct beings that are not united in substance, a view sometimes called social trinitarianism. They believe the three individual deities are "one" in will or purpose, as Jesus was "one" with his disciples, and that the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit constitute a single godhead united in purpose. Latter-day Saints believe that Christ is the Firstborn of the Father, that he is subordinate to God the Father (Matthew 26:39), and that Christ created the universe. Latter-day Saints do not subscribe to the ideas that Christ was unlike the Father in substance, that the Father could not appear on earth, or that Christ was adopted by the Father, as presented in Arianism. Latter-day Saints assert that both God and the resurrected Christ have perfected glorified, physical bodies, but do not otherwise classify deity in terms of substance. While Latter-day Saints regard God the Father as the supreme being and literal father of the spirits of all humankind, they also teach that Christ and the Holy Spirit are equally divine and that they share in the Father's "comprehension of all things".
The Members Church of God International believes in the divinity of Christ but rejects the doctrine of Trinity.
Oneness Pentecostalism is a subset of Pentecostalism that believes God is only one person, and that he manifests himself in different ways, faces, or "modes": "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (or Holy Ghost) are different designations for the one God. God is the Father. God is the Holy Spirit. The Son is God manifest in flesh. The term Son always refers to the Incarnation, and never to deity apart from humanity." Oneness Pentecostals believe that Jesus was "Son" only when he became flesh on earth, but was the Father prior to being made human. They refer to the Father as the "Spirit" and the Son as the "Flesh". Oneness Pentecostals reject the Trinity doctrine, viewing it as pagan and unscriptural, and hold to the Jesus' Name doctrine with respect to baptisms. Oneness Pentecostals are often referred to as "Modalists" or "Sabellians" or "Jesus Only".
Denominations within the Sabbatarian tradition (Armstrongism) believe that Christ the Son and God the Father are co-eternal, but do not teach that the Holy Spirit is a being or person. Armstrong theology holds that God is a "Family" that expands eventually, that "God reproduces Himself", but that originally there was a co-eternal "Duality", God and the Word, rather than a "Trinity".
Swedenborgianism holds that the Trinity exists in one person, the Lord God Jesus Christ. The Father, the being or soul of God, was born into the world and put on a body from Mary. Throughout his life, Jesus put away all human desires and tendencies until he was completely divine. After his resurrection, he influences the world through the Holy Spirit, which is his activity. In this view, Jesus Christ is the one God; the Father as to his soul, the Son as to his body, and the Holy Spirit as to his activity in the world.
Unitarian Christians and Unitarian Universalist Christians are Holy Spirit Unitarians.[clarification needed]
Nontrinitarian doctrine often generates controversy among mainstream Christians, most of whom consider it heresy not to believe in the doctrine of the Trinity. Under the Codes of Theodosius and Justinian, teaching and writing against the Nicene Creed were punishable crimes, resulting in the confiscation of property, banishment, or the death of the guilty.