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 Post subject: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Mon Dec 03, 2018 10:20 pm 
θεά
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I've redesigned my site and kicked off a new series on the Apostle Junia in Romans 16:7:

Introducing the Junia Series

I'll be examining all of the patristic commentators on Junia, posting a new translation of Origen's comments on her, calling out the (mis)use of Pseudo-Epiphanius among the anti-Junia crowd, and critiquing Michael Burer's 2015 follow-up to his and Dan Wallace's 2001 article on Junia.

I won't reference Mormonism often, but the series might interest a few people here.

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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 4:46 pm 
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Hello

I shared your work with a Reformed Tradition friend of mine who disagrees. I don not know Greek very well and thought you might comment.

"Hi Noel,

We've been past this tree before.

There is nothing new in the arguments presented. The dative in Greek (the word 'apostles' is in the dative) may be rendered as 'by', 'from', 'with', 'among', 'to' or it might be a dative of indefinite reference. The word 'episemoi' (masculine plural) might be rendered 'marked' 'stamped' 'coined' 'spotted' 'striped' 'notable' 'remarkable' 'conspicuous' 'notorious'. All the relative pronouns and adjectives that refer to Andronikos and Junia(s) are masculine. In light of this fact, it might be legitimate to translate verse 7 as "Greet Andronikos and Junia(s), my (male) relatives and (male) fellow prisoners -- (which males are) esteemed by the (male) apostles -- who (as males) were in Christ before me." Even rendering it 'of note among the apostles' in no way requires the interpretation that these two Christians were apostles. It can mean that, to their credit, these people (whether male or female), according to the opinion held among the apostles, were remarkable Christians.

Until some real evidence is produced, I don't believe that either Andronikos or Junia(s) were Apostles of Jesus Christ, but were Christians highly esteemed

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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 7:43 pm 
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Aussieguy, does your friend have any insight as to whether the Roman Goddess Juno may have been a guy?

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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:59 pm 
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moksha wrote:
Aussieguy, does your friend have any insight as to whether the Roman Goddess Juno may have been a guy?


:lol:


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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:06 pm 
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aussieguy55 wrote:
Hello

I shared your work with a Reformed Tradition friend of mine who disagrees. I don not know Greek very well and thought you might comment.

"Hi Noel,

We've been past this tree before.

There is nothing new in the arguments presented. The dative in Greek (the word 'apostles' is in the dative) may be rendered as 'by', 'from', 'with', 'among', 'to' or it might be a dative of indefinite reference. The word 'episemoi' (masculine plural) might be rendered 'marked' 'stamped' 'coined' 'spotted' 'striped' 'notable' 'remarkable' 'conspicuous' 'notorious'. All the relative pronouns and adjectives that refer to Andronikos and Junia(s) are masculine. In light of this fact, it might be legitimate to translate verse 7 as "Greet Andronikos and Junia(s), my (male) relatives and (male) fellow prisoners -- (which males are) esteemed by the (male) apostles -- who (as males) were in Christ before me." Even rendering it 'of note among the apostles' in no way requires the interpretation that these two Christians were apostles. It can mean that, to their credit, these people (whether male or female), according to the opinion held among the apostles, were remarkable Christians.

Until some real evidence is produced, I don't believe that either Andronikos or Junia(s) were Apostles of Jesus Christ, but were Christians highly esteemed


No offense, Noel, but your friend is not literate in New Testament Greek.


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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 12:23 pm 
God
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Thank you MsJack for the heads-up. Looking forward for the next instalments.

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 Post subject: Re: New series on Junia
PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2019 11:41 am 
God
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I realize there are more than a couple of discussions on this topic . I was interested in this presentations reflection on the problematic Timothy passage. The speaker starts by declining to claim complete understanding of the problem but he is enough expert to be worth listening to (N T Wright)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FSZPyZFWQI0


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