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 Post subject: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:08 am 
God

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spotlight wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
If that is the case, science has been unable to provide the exact age of the earth.

As exact as the measuring device allows. Error bars are a reality of all measurement. Just because there are error bars when you hang a painting on your wall does not mean it isn't hanging 5 ft off the floor. Well is it exactly 5ft or is it 5ft and an angstrom? Well if you can't answer that then it must be reasonable to assert that it is really only an inch above the floor. Does that logic fail sound familiar?

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Science has been unable to demonstrate how biological life can be created.

A god of the gaps argument is a logical fallacy. Besides Szostak has answered most of it to the thinking of reasonable minds.
http://molbio.mgh.harvard.edu/szostakwe ... tions.html

Quote:
Scientific method has been unable to prove that there is no GOD.

Argument from ignorance (from Latin: argumentum ad ignorantiam), also known as appeal to ignorance (in which ignorance represents "a lack of contrary evidence"), is a fallacy in informal logic. It asserts that a proposition is true because it has not yet been proven false (or vice versa).

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Scientific research has not with absolute assurance proven that there was never a World Wide Flood.

Yes it has. The fact that there are creationists that disagree with this is no more relevant than the fact that there are flat earthers who disagree with the fact that the earth is a spheroid.

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Science investigation has never absolutely shown that all living creatures originated from one common ancestor.

Yes it has to an exponent of certainty now in the thousands. Again the fact that there are creationists that disagree with this is no more relevant than the fact that there are flat earthers who disagree with the fact that the earth is a spheroid.

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Without absolute proof that can be replicated, scientific fact is not an honest tool for undermining faith --- in fact, it become faith to those who selectively study science for determining other probabilities aside from God.

Science does not deal in proof. But it does deal with evidence and that which can be replicated. Inference is allowed as well though you have motivation to vote that out of science. Science pays no mind to faith. And finding other probabilities aside from God is no more a motivation behind the scientific enterprise than finding other probabilities aside from Voodoo, Odin or the deities of the Aboriginal Australians.

Your faith is not special so stop with your special pleading.

"Reasonable" minds doesn't indicate truth or fact. Reasonable minds indicates rationalization. You rationalization of the data is in error due to your mindset and what you determined yourself to represent as "reasonable".


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 8:59 am 
God
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So is religion. So is the Bible.

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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:36 am 
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LittleNipper,
Feel free to elaborate where Szostak has made an error in any of his published papers. Or point out where the data supports creationism over abiogenesis. If you cannot do so maybe you are rationalizing when you ignore his work. :rolleyes:

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"In my mind science could make great leaps forward if it can just get over this nonsense about observed things." - Franktalk

" I say there is no such thing as a biological creature." - Franktalk


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:10 am 
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spotlight wrote:
LittleNipper,
Feel free to elaborate where Szostak has made an error in any of his published papers. Or point out where the data supports creationism over abiogenesis. If you cannot do so maybe you are rationalizing when you ignore his work. :rolleyes:


Nipper doesn't need books. He has God.

Does that mean he belongs to one of those clubs where the leaders wear funny hats or suits and nobody can understand what they're saying? :lol: I hear they're very important.

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"The LDS Church looks exactly like a bunch of bureaucratic business people and televangelists, with no training in theology, attempting to commoditize religion, using a pastiche of standard fundamentalist Christian sermonizing and Joseph Smith's Frontier Tall Tales. It looks like that because that's what it is." --DarthJ


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:54 am 
God

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Maksutov wrote:
spotlight wrote:
LittleNipper,
Feel free to elaborate where Szostak has made an error in any of his published papers. Or point out where the data supports creationism over abiogenesis. If you cannot do so maybe you are rationalizing when you ignore his work. :rolleyes:


Nipper doesn't need books. He has God.

Does that mean he belongs to one of those clubs where the leaders wear funny hats or suits and nobody can understand what they're saying? :lol: I hear they're very important.


I don't have a problem with God. Just what some mortals claim he said.


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:05 am 
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The CCC wrote:
Maksutov wrote:

Nipper doesn't need books. He has God.

Does that mean he belongs to one of those clubs where the leaders wear funny hats or suits and nobody can understand what they're saying? :lol: I hear they're very important.


I don't have a problem with God. Just what some mortals claim he said.


You're not supposed to see them. You're just supposed to concentrate on the God part. The people are all green screen.

Image

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"The LDS Church looks exactly like a bunch of bureaucratic business people and televangelists, with no training in theology, attempting to commoditize religion, using a pastiche of standard fundamentalist Christian sermonizing and Joseph Smith's Frontier Tall Tales. It looks like that because that's what it is." --DarthJ


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 11:33 am 
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Any tool can be abused. That is the nature of tools. Their employ is determined by the user.

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It is better to be a warrior in a garden, than a gardener at war.

Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:43 pm 
God

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Can you think of anything that has been more blatantly abused or used to abuse than religion? I can't!

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No precept or claim is more deservedly suspect or more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:45 pm 
God

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In the LDS faith we are supposed to be able to see them. However most won't in this life. The wizard never did give the Tin Man anything he didn't already have. :smile:


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 12:51 pm 
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The CCC wrote:
In the LDS faith we are supposed to be able to see them. However most won't in this life. The wizard never did give the Tin Man anything he didn't already have. :smile:


You must live in the tropic of Sir Galahad. :wink:

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"The LDS Church looks exactly like a bunch of bureaucratic business people and televangelists, with no training in theology, attempting to commoditize religion, using a pastiche of standard fundamentalist Christian sermonizing and Joseph Smith's Frontier Tall Tales. It looks like that because that's what it is." --DarthJ


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 1:20 pm 
God

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Maksutov wrote:
The CCC wrote:
In the LDS faith we are supposed to be able to see them. However most won't in this life. The wizard never did give the Tin Man anything he didn't already have. :smile:


You must live in the tropic of Sir Galahad. :wink:


Absolutely. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 6:54 pm 
God
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America wrote:
The wizard Oz never did give nothin' to Tin Man anything that he didn't, didn't, already have. :smile:


Maksutov wrote:
You must live in the tropic of Sir Galahad. :wink:


The CCC wrote:
Absolutely. :lol:


You know you want to hear it again, so here you go:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GtyKcDKU5oU

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David Hume: "---Mistakes in philosophy are merely ridiculous, those in religion are dangerous."

DrW: "Mistakes in science are learning opportunities and are eventually corrected."


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 9:58 pm 
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What about the tool of evolution going haywire and producing members of the Tea Party? Of course, it is probably humankind's fault for having an abundance of aluminum foil.

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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Fri Apr 22, 2016 10:09 pm 
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LittleNipper wrote:
Reasonable minds indicates rationalization. You rationalization of the data is in error due to your mindset and what you determined yourself to represent as "reasonable".


LittleNipper -

1. Is it important that the Earth possesses an exact date of creation? Why or why not?

2. What is a reasonable definition of exact, in this case?

3. What is the exact age of the Earth according to yourself? Explain how this figure is determined.

Thanks,

-cp-


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 5:57 am 
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Gunnar wrote:
Can you think of anything that has been more blatantly abused or used to abuse than religion? I can't!


Let's see...
Government

That's about it. Of course, you combine government and religion into one entity and you get a power duo of abuse. Hurray!


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 7:42 am 
God
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For most of recorded history, religion was government.

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Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 8:18 am 
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SteelHead wrote:
For most of recorded history, religion was government.

I know. That's precisely when religious abuse was the worst.

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No precept or claim is more deservedly suspect or more likely to be false than one that can only be supported by invoking the claim of Divine authority for it--no matter who or what claims such authority.


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:14 am 
God

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Gunnar wrote:
Can you think of anything that has been more blatantly abused or used to abuse than religion? I can't!


Yes. Politics.


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 10:14 am 
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SteelHead wrote:
For most of recorded history, religion was government.


Prophet Kings were the Abrahamic template. That's what Joseph was trying to get back to when he had himself crowned King and was organizing the Council of 50. I'm still trying to figure where religious monarchs fit in our Constitutional system. Even in 1844 things weren't *that* loosey goosey.

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"The LDS Church looks exactly like a bunch of bureaucratic business people and televangelists, with no training in theology, attempting to commoditize religion, using a pastiche of standard fundamentalist Christian sermonizing and Joseph Smith's Frontier Tall Tales. It looks like that because that's what it is." --DarthJ


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 4:51 pm 
God

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canpakes wrote:
LittleNipper wrote:
Reasonable minds indicates rationalization. You rationalization of the data is in error due to your mindset and what you determined yourself to represent as "reasonable".


LittleNipper -

1. Is it important that the Earth possesses an exact date of creation? Why or why not?

2. What is a reasonable definition of exact, in this case?

3. What is the exact age of the Earth according to yourself? Explain how this figure is determined.

Thanks,

-cp-

I believe the issue is that we are told that evolution is a fact and that the science is exact. Then we are told the Universe is Billions of years old. We are told the earth is billions of years old. Exactly how many billions? Do they really know or are they surmising? And if they are surmising, then how is this an exact science?

I believe Our Almighty Lord created the Universe and time approximately 10,000 years ago. He created it with an ecological maturity for the sake of the creatures He creatively designed to populate this planet. A scientist picks up a natural diamond and speculates that it took I billion to 3.3 billion years to create, how is that accurate? I need a door 7 feet tall by 3 feet wide --- the secular scientist provides one 21 feet tall by 9 feet wide and calls it in fact, an exact fit? Reduce a Billion years to seconds and you will find that a newborn would be over 31 years old when that time was up (hardly a baby anymore).

The truth be told that a door of that mismatched size would be a total waste of time, material and effort to make ---- useless for the application. Now, I do believe that GOD gave to every kind the ability to survive and adapt within God ordained parameters. This produces breeds of animals and races among humans. It doesn't cause additional kinds or competing species to arise. In fact, the opposite is the truth. There are less species today than there were even a hundred years ago and not more. There are more breeds today of horses, cows, dogs, cats, etc., but not more species.


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 Post subject: Re: Science is a tool that can be abused!
PostPosted: Sat Apr 23, 2016 9:03 pm 
God

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Believe anything you want. But stay the hell away from science.
SEE https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CMXHKixqOM8


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