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 Post subject: Re: Is the Bible Inerrant?
PostPosted: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:57 pm 
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huckelberry wrote:
Considering something like the Old Testament which is a result of compiling and editing what constitutes an original manuscript?

Is editing inspired?


Can fiction be inspired? C. S. Lewis lovers say yes. So why can't the Bible be inspired fiction? :wink:

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 Post subject: Re: Is the Bible Inerrant?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:14 pm 
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Bret Ripley wrote:
mikegriffith1 wrote:
The oldest complete New Testament manuscript was written hundreds of years after the originals were composed. We have a few fragments that are first-century material, but even those are 20-30 years removed from the originals.
Which New Testament fragments would you date to the first century? P137 (aka Oxyrhynchus Papyrus 5345)?


The likely earliest of the New Testament fragments that we have is a fragment from the Gospel of John, which is dated from the 2nd Century.

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As for the New Testament, there is one second-century fragment of John's gospel known as the Rylands fragment, but it is very small and contains only a few verses.


http://miketgriffith.com/files/inerrancy.htm



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The Rylands Library Papyrus P52, also known as the St John's fragment and with an accession reference of Papyrus Rylands Greek 457, is a fragment from a papyrus codex, measuring only 3.5 by 2.5 inches (8.9 by 6 cm) at its widest; and conserved with the Rylands Papyri at the John Rylands University Library Manchester, UK. The front (recto) contains parts of seven lines from the Gospel of John 18:31–33, in Greek, and the back (verso) contains parts of seven lines from verses 37–38.[3] Since 2007, the papyrus has been on permanent display in the library's Deansgate building.

Although Rylands {\displaystyle {\mathfrak {P}}} {\mathfrak {P}}52 is generally accepted as the earliest extant record of a canonical New Testament text,[4] the dating of the papyrus is by no means the subject of consensus among scholars. The original editor proposed a date range of 100-150 CE;[5] while a recent exercise by Pasquale Orsini and Willy Clarysse, aiming to generate consistent revised date estimates for all New Testament papyri written before the mid-fourth century, has proposed a date for {\displaystyle {\mathfrak {P}}} {\mathfrak {P}}52 of 125-175 CE.[1]


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rylands ... apyrus_P52

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 Post subject: Re: Is the Bible Inerrant?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 1:20 pm 
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Maksutov wrote:
huckelberry wrote:
Considering something like the Old Testament which is a result of compiling and editing what constitutes an original manuscript?

Is editing inspired?


Can fiction be inspired? C. S. Lewis lovers say yes. So why can't the Bible be inspired fiction? :wink:


I feel quite sure some portions are inspired fiction and should be read and understood that way. It is a bit trickier with history as any story like telling of history is likely to contain a dimension of fiction.

Inspiration is a word used to speak of great insight into the human condition, or natural world or the possibilities of art or technology. It is also sometimes used for the encouragement or direction from God. The first meaning could work without the second being involved but I do not think the second could function with out the first. Communication requires speaker and hearer. If that is so then I think overestimating a literal reading could be noise blocking that communication link. Not hearing the human dimension with its limitation s and misunderstanding would limit the ability to hear Gods leading and direction in the result. In some instances I think the Bible opens a persons ears to Gods lead while in others it , or their noise about it, could block Gods communication.


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 Post subject: Re: Is the Bible Inerrant?
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2018 10:20 pm 
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Bret Ripley wrote:
mikegriffith1 wrote:
The oldest complete New Testament manuscript was written hundreds of years after the originals were composed. We have a few fragments that are first-century material, but even those are 20-30 years removed from the originals.
Which New Testament fragments would you date to the first century? P137 (aka Oxyrhynchus Papyrus 5345)?


I think that Mike meant to instead state second-century. P137 was originally thought to have come from the first-century, but it is likely to have come from the late second-century or early third-century.

Quote:
On the basis of the handwriting, Obbink and Colomo estimate that the manuscript was written in the range of A.D. 150–250. The manuscript itself is tiny, only 4.4 x 4 cm. It contains a few letters on each side from verses 7–9 and 16–18 of Mark 1. Lines of writing preserved on each side indicate that this fragment comes from the bottom of the first written page of a codex—a book rather than a scroll. The text does not present any surprising readings for a manuscript of its age, and the codex format is also what we would expect.

Even though it is not quite so early as many hoped, P137 is still a significant find. Its date range makes it likely the earliest copy of Mark’s gospel.


https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/20 ... y-fcm.html

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