Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

The catch-all forum for general topics and debates. Minimal moderation. Rated PG to PG-13.
Post Reply
jfro18
CTR B
Posts: 143
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:08 pm

Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by jfro18 »

There were some comments in the 116 pages Don Bradley thread about the Anthon caractors.

Obviously the church has held the 'Caractors' to be authentic since they put them on the cover of the Book of Mormon at one point, but apologists now seem to want to say they aren't what Anthon saw so we can't know they are the actual Book of Mormon characters that were shown to Anthon.

Anthon made the description that there was more to the characters in what he saw, with "rude delineation of a circle divided into various compartments, decked with various strange marks, and evidently copied after the Aztec calendar given by Humboldt," (1834) or "a rude representation of the Mexican zodiac" (1841).

Does anyone have any thoughts on this? I tend to think they were likely copied from the anthon transcript and were from Joseph Smith, but I know why apologists don't want this to be true (see the Tanner's "Deformed English" image and it's a massive problem).

Image
Image

User avatar
Shulem
Son of Perdition
Posts: 10954
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:48 pm

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by Shulem »

Back in the day I spent quite a bit of time studying these things and made firm connections between the Anthon Transcript and Joseph Smith's Egyptian Alphabet & Grammar. Characters in these Kirtland era papers are most certainly taken from the Anthon Transcript. Mormon apologists today will do and say anything to deny the obvious concrete truth in order to keep their abstract Mormon fantasy claims alive.

Ah me-os
Image


This is the name and sign given for the Eternal God who has no beginning or end, the Son Ahman who is ahlish. The character is included in the top left hand register of p. 33, of the Grammar & Alphabet of the Egyptian Language, "Second part of the Alphabet 1st Degree" in the handwriting of W.W. Phelps:

Image
"Ah me-os - God without beginning or end"


The testimony of three more witnesses are given in other manuscripts along with the sign and the name— the Eternal God:

Image
"Second part of the first degree
Ahmeos - God without beginning or end"

(EAllusion WWP, p. C)

Image
"The second part first degree
Ahmeos - God without beginning or end"

(EAllusion Joseph Smith, p.B)

Image
"Ah me-os God, without beginning or end"
(EAllusion OC, p.A)

The sacred sign of Ah-me-os was utilized by Joseph Smith and denotes the eternal nature of God. The prophet was in charge of the Egyptian Alphabet & Grammar project. Herein, we are given a true reformed Egyptian hieroglyph (Mormon 9:32) directly from the golden plates of the Book of Mormon!

Here are some characters on the 1st & 6th line of the Anthon Transcript and I have boldly circled the signs in question:

Image

Image


See if YOU can find the sign on the Broadside advertisement:

(look on the first line)

Image

User avatar
Shulem
Son of Perdition
Posts: 10954
Joined: Thu Jun 30, 2011 7:48 pm

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by Shulem »

Please also see the following link which prove character connections between Joseph Smith's Egyptian Alphabet & Grammar and the Anthon Transcipt:

Alchibeth, Alkobeth, Alkubeth

Image


Image
Last edited by Shulem on Sun Jan 05, 2020 12:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
grindael
Dragon
Posts: 6783
Joined: Mon Aug 08, 2011 2:15 am

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by grindael »

Hello Jfro,

I did a whole series of articles on this in 2012 when I discovered a photo taken by Jacob Hicks of the "Caractors" document in the 1860's that included the torn off bottom of the page it was on...

Soon after I discovered the photo at the Clay County Museum web site, some others also discovered it, and the Joseph Smith papers eventually published on it. I trace the origins of the document, and what really happened to the "Anthon" transcript. It's a fascinating story and hope you will enjoy it.

https://mormonitemusings.com/2013/11/19 ... ors-photo/
Riding on a speeding train; trapped inside a revolving door;
Lost in the riddle of a quatrain; Stuck in an elevator between floors.
One focal point in a random world can change your direction:
One step where events converge may alter your perception.

jfro18
CTR B
Posts: 143
Joined: Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:08 pm

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by jfro18 »

grindael wrote:Hello Jfro,

I did a whole series of articles on this in 2012 when I discovered a photo taken by Jacob Hicks of the "Caractors" document in the 1860's that included the torn off bottom of the page it was on...

Soon after I discovered the photo at the Clay County Museum web site, some others also discovered it, and the Joseph Smith papers eventually published on it. I trace the origins of the document, and what really happened to the "Anthon" transcript. It's a fascinating story and hope you will enjoy it.

https://mormonitemusings.com/2013/11/19 ... ors-photo/


this is amazing - I have read the first two parts and going to tackle part 3 in a bit. Seriously great work and way beyond what I've seen on the whole incident in writing about the "cannot read a sealed book" post I did last year... I'm going to need to beef that up down the road because this gives so much more depth and context to everything!

Thanks for sharing the link!

User avatar
Mormon Think
Area Authority
Posts: 615
Joined: Wed Nov 28, 2012 6:45 pm

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by Mormon Think »

We at MormonThink did a pretty big analysis of the whole Anthon visit some years ago. You can read about it here: http://www.mormonthink.com/book-of-morm ... htm#anthon

At the end are links to Dan Vogel's most excellent 3 part video on the Anthon characters.

Bill

User avatar
Res Ipsa
God
Posts: 9753
Joined: Fri Oct 05, 2012 5:37 pm

Re: Caractors Document vs. Anthon Transcript

Post by Res Ipsa »

grindael wrote:Hello Jfro,

I did a whole series of articles on this in 2012 when I discovered a photo taken by Jacob Hicks of the "Caractors" document in the 1860's that included the torn off bottom of the page it was on...

Soon after I discovered the photo at the Clay County Museum web site, some others also discovered it, and the Joseph Smith papers eventually published on it. I trace the origins of the document, and what really happened to the "Anthon" transcript. It's a fascinating story and hope you will enjoy it.

https://mormonitemusings.com/2013/11/19 ... ors-photo/


Really interesting series of blog posts, Grindael. Thanks for linking them.
​“The ideal subject of totalitarian rule is not the convinced Nazi or the dedicated communist, but people for whom the distinction between fact and fiction, true and false, no longer exists.”

― Hannah Arendt, The Origins of Totalitarianism, 1951

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 6 guests