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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:51 am 
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And the remnant were slain with the sword of him that sat upon the horse, which sword proceeded out of his mouth: and all the fowls were filled with their flesh.


You're a dead man, Philo.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:51 am 
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Jersey Girl wrote:
That doesn't answer my questions. I'm sure that Philo Sofee will answer them himself.


It absolutely answers your question. "THE main idea is:

What does the OT establish, - Jehovah as a kind and loving deity, or Jehovah as a monster?"

- Doc

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:39 am 
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Sounds like a tall order. I don't' want to go back and re-read the OT to find 2 verses for each of the ones listed in the links MG provides, but all the best to Philo. I guess I did a good part of the work for MG (I think he googled "is the OT god a monster", and "where does the OT say God is loving"). But the articles themselves? Pathetic, I'd say. the verses carry some beauty, though.

Quote:
The LORD, the LORD, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin. (Ex 34:6-7)


Quote:
Is not Ephraim my dear son, the child in whom I delight? Though I often speak against him, I still remember him. Therefore my heart yearns for him; I have great compassion for him," declares the LORD. (Jer 31:20)


Quote:
I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me, so that they will never turn away from me. I will rejoice in doing them good and will assuredly plant them in this land with all my heart and soul. (Jer 32:40-41)


Quote:
The LORD said to me, "Go, show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another and is an adulteress. Love her as the LORD loves the Israelites, though they turn to other gods and love the sacred raisin cakes." (Hos 3:1)


Quote:
The LORD upholds all those who fall and lifts up all who are bowed down.
The eyes of all look to you, and you give them their food at the proper time.
You open your hand and satisfy the desires of every living thing.
The LORD is righteous in all his ways and loving toward all he has made.
(Ps 145:14-17)


Quote:
He upholds the cause of the oppressed
and gives food to the hungry.
The LORD sets prisoners free,
the LORD gives sight to the blind,
the LORD lifts up those who are bowed down,
the LORD loves the righteous.
The LORD watches over the alien
and sustains the fatherless and the widow,
but he frustrates the ways of the wicked.
(Ps 146:7-9)


Quote:
But you, O God, do see trouble and grief;
you consider it to take it in hand.
The victim commits himself to you;
you are the helper of the fatherless...
You hear, O LORD , the desire of the afflicted;
you encourage them, and you listen to their cry,
defending the fatherless and the oppressed,
in order that man, who is of the earth, may terrify no more.
(Ps 10:14, 17-18)


Quote:
As surely as I live, declares the Sovereign LORD, I take no pleasure in the death of the wicked, but rather that they turn from their ways and live. (Ezek 33:11)


Quote:
Rid yourselves of all the offenses you have committed, and get a new heart and a new spirit. Why will you die, O house of Israel? For I take no pleasure in the death of anyone, declares the Sovereign LORD . Repent and live! (Ezek 18:31-32)


Quote:
How can I give you up, Ephraim? How can I hand you over, Israel? How can I treat you like Admah? How can I make you like Zeboiim? My heart is changed within me; all my compassion is aroused. I will not carry out my fierce anger, nor will I turn and devastate Ephraim. For I am God, and not man - the Holy One among you. I will not come in wrath. (Hos 11:8-9)


Quote:
For men are not cast off by the Lord forever. Though he brings grief, he will show compassion, so great is his unfailing love. For he does not willingly bring affliction or grief to the children of men. (Lam 3:31-33)


Quote:
God does not take away life; instead, he devises ways so that a banished person may not remain estranged from him. (2 Sam 14:14)


Quote:
If at any time I announce that a nation or kingdom is to be uprooted, torn down and destroyed, and if that nation I warned repents of its evil, then I will relent and not inflict on it the disaster I had planned. (Jer 18:7-8)


Quote:
Go up and down the streets of Jerusalem, look around and consider, search through her squares. If you can find but one person who deals honestly and seeks the truth, I will forgive this city. (Jer 5:1)


Quote:
Even now," declares the LORD,
"return to me with all your heart,
with fasting and weeping and mourning."

Rend your heart
and not your garments.
Return to the LORD your God,
for he is gracious and compassionate,
slow to anger and abounding in love,
and he relents from sending calamity.
Who knows? He may turn and have pity
and leave behind a blessing -
grain offerings and drink offerings
for the LORD your God.
(Joel 2:12-14)


Quote:
When God saw what they did and how they turned from their evil ways, he had compassion and did not bring upon them the destruction he had threatened. (Jonah 3:10)


Quote:
When all these blessings and curses I have set before you come upon you and you take them to heart wherever the LORD your God disperses you among the nations, and when you and your children return to the LORD your God and obey him with all your heart and with all your soul according to everything I command you today, then the LORD your God will restore your fortunes and have compassion on you and gather you again from all the nations where he scattered you. Even if you have been banished to the most distant land under the heavens, from there the LORD your God will gather you and bring you back. (Dt 30:1-4)


Quote:
Who is a God like you, who pardons sin and forgives the transgression of the remnant of his inheritance? You do not stay angry forever but delight to show mercy. You will again have compassion on us; you will tread our sins underfoot and hurl all our iniquities into the depths of the sea. (Micah 7:18-19)


Quote:
My son, do not despise the LORD's discipline
and do not resent his rebuke,
because the LORD disciplines those he loves,
as a father the son he delights in.
(Pr 3:11-12)


Quote:
Lord, in Your lovingkindness You have led the people whom You have redeemed; In Your strength You have guided them to Your holy abiding place. (Exodus 15:13)


Quote:
The Lord your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God who does not show partiality nor take a bribe. He executes justice for the orphan and the widow, and shows His love for the stranger by giving him food and clothing. (Deuteronomy 10:17-19)


Quote:
The Lord your God turned the curse into a blessing for you because the Lord your God loves you. (Deuteronomy 23:5)


Quote:
Indeed, the Lord loves the people. All His holy ones (saints) are in His hand. (Deuteronomy 33:3)


Quote:
May the Lord show lovingkindness and truth to you. (2 Samuel 2:6)


Quote:
The Lord makes salvation and deliverance evident and shows lovingkindness to all His people forever. (2 Samuel 22:51)


Quote:
Give thanks to the Lord, for he is good; His love endures forever. (1 Chronicles 16:34)


Quote:
The Lord's lovingkindness is everlasting. (1 Chronicles 16:41, 2 Chronicles 5:13, 7:3, 7:6, 20:21)


Quote:
Our God, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God, You are a gracious and compassionate God who keeps lovingkindness and in Your great compassion does not forsake. (Nehemiah 9:31-32)


Quote:
You God have granted me life, mercy, and lovingkindness; And Your care has preserved my spirit. (Job 10:12)


Quote:
All the paths of the Lord are lovingkindness and truth (Psalm 25:10)


Quote:
I will rejoice and be glad in Your lovingkindness, Because You have seen my affliction; You have known the troubles of my soul (Psalm 31:7)


Quote:
Lovingkindness surrounds those who trust in the Lord (Psalm 32:10)


Quote:
The Lord loves righteousness and justice; The earth is full of the lovingkindness of the Lord. (Psalm 33:5)


Quote:
Your lovingkindness, O Lord, extends to the heavens, Your faithfulness reaches to the skies. (Psalm 36:5)


Quote:
The Lord loves justice and does not forsake His godly ones; They are preserved forever. (Psalm 37:28)


Quote:
You, O Lord, will not withhold Your compassion from me; Your lovingkindness and Your truth will continually preserve me. (Psalm 40:11)


Quote:
The lovingkindness of God lasts all day long. (Psalm 52:1)


Quote:
God accomplishes all things for me. He will send from heaven and save me. God will send forth His lovingkindness and His truth. (Psalm 57:2-3)


Quote:
You love is so great it reaches the heavens; your trustworthy faithfulness reaches to the clouds. (Psalm 57:10)


Quote:
Your love O Lord is better than life (Psalm 63:3)


Quote:
In Jesus lovingkindness and truth have met together; Righteousness and peace have kissed each other. (Psalm 85:10, New Covenant Paraphrase)

For You, Lord, are good, and eager to put your forgiveness on display. You are abundant in lovingkindness to all who call upon You. (Psalm 86:5)

You, O Lord, are a God merciful and gracious, patient and abundant in lovingkindness and truth. (Psalm 86:15)

Righteousness and justice are the foundation of Your throne; Lovingkindness and truth go before You. (Psalm 89:14)

If I should say, “My foot has slipped,” Your lovingkindness, O Lord, will hold me up. (Psalm 94:18)

The Lord is good; His lovingkindness is everlasting and His loyal trustworthiness extends to all generations. (Psalm 100:5)

Bless the Lord, O my soul, and forget none of His benefits; He pardons all your sins, He heals all your diseases; He redeems your life from the pit, He crowns you with lovingkindness and compassion; He satisfies your years with good things. (Psalm 103:2-5)

The Lord is compassionate and gracious, patient and abounding in lovingkindness. He no longer strives with us, Nor does He retain His anger towards us. He has not dealt with us according to our sins, Nor rewarded us according to our faults. For as high as the heavens are above the earth, So great is His lovingkindness toward those who trust His Son. As far as the east is from the west, So far has He removed our sins from us. Just as a father has compassion on his children, So the Lord, our Father, has compassion on those who trust Him. (Psalm 103:8-13, New Covenant Paraphrase)

Consider the lovingkindnesses of the Lord. (Psalm 107:43)

The Lord's lovingkindness is great toward us, and the truth of the Lord is everlasting. Praise the Lord! (Psalm 117:2)

Put your hope in the Lord Jesus. He has lovingkindness and has abundantly paid for our debt with His blood. He has delivered all His people from all their guilt. (Psalm 130:7-8, New Covenant Paraphrase)

Give thanks to the God of gods, the Lord of lords, for He is good. He gives food to all beings. He alone does great wonders. The Lord has remembered us in our low estate and has rescued us from the adversary. Give thanks to the God of heaven, For His lovingkindness is everlasting. (from Psalm 136)

The Lord is gracious and merciful; Patient and great in lovingkindness. The Lord is good to all, and His mercies are over all His works. (Psalm 145:8-9)

The Lord executes justice for the oppressed, gives food to the hungry, sets the prisoners free. The Lord opens the eyes of the blind & raises up those who are bowed down. The Lord loves the righteous. The Lord protects the strangers, He supports the fatherless and the widow, But He thwarts the way of the wicked. (Psalm 146:7-9)


Quote:
My son, do not lightly regard the guidance of the Lord, nor be irritated or grieved when refuted by him. For the Lord teaches the one he loves like a father instructs a son he is pleased with. (Proverbs 3:11-12)

By lovingkindness and truth guilt is removed. (Proverbs 16:6)

Thus says the Lord, your Creator, “Do not fear, for I have redeemed you; I have called you by name; you are Mine! I am the Lord your God, The Holy One, your Savior. You are precious in My sight. You are honored and I love you. Do not fear, for I am with you. You are My witnesses and My servants whom I have chosen, So that you may know and trust Me and understand that I am He. Before Me there was no God formed, and there will be none after Me. I, even I, am the Lord, and there is no savior besides Me. It is I who have declared and saved and proclaimed, and I am God. Even from eternity I am He, and there is no one who can deliver you out of My hand; I act and no one can reverse it." (from Isaiah 43)

"With everlasting lovingkindness I will have compassion on you” says the Lord your Redeemer. "I have sworn that I will not be angry with you nor will I reject you. For the mountains may be removed and the hills may shake, But My lovingkindness will not be removed from you, And My covenant of peace will not be shaken,” says the Lord who has compassion on you. (Isaiah 54:8-10)

God has given us great things and done many great things for us by His compassion and from the abundance of His lovingkindnesses. (Isaiah 63:7)

In God's love and in His mercy He redeemed us. (Isaiah 63:9)

Thus says the Lord, “Let not a wise man boast of his wisdom, and let not the mighty man boast of his might, let not a rich man boast of his riches; but let him who boasts boast of this, that he understands and knows Me, that I am the Lord who exercises lovingkindness, justice and righteousness on earth because I delight in these things,” declares the Lord. (Jeremiah 9:23-24)

The Lord appeared saying, “I have loved you with an everlasting love; Therefore I have drawn you with lovingkindness." (Jeremiah 31:3)

The Lord’s lovingkindnesses certainly never cease because His compassions never fail. His love, kindness, and compassion are new every morning. Great is Your loyal trustworthiness O Lord. (Lamentations 3:22-23)

Where there is sorrow & grief the Lord will have compassion according to His abundant lovingkindness. (Lamentations 3:32)

In that day I, the Lord will make a new covenant, “I will betroth you to Me forever; Yes, I will betroth you to Me in righteousness and in justice, In lovingkindness and in compassion, and I will betroth you to Me in faithfulness. Then you will know the Lord. I will also have compassion on her who had not obtained compassion, and I will say to those who were not My people, ‘You are My people!’ and they will say, ‘You are my God!’” (Hosea 2:18-20,23)

I will heal your backsliding. I will cure you from turning away. I love you freely. I have no anger towards you. (Hosea 14:4, New Covenant Paraphrase)

There is no God like you. You pardon guilt and do not hold rebellious acts against us. You did not retain anger against us beyond the cross of your Son. You delight in unchanging love. You have compassion on us. You crushed our sinful deeds under foot. Yes, You cast all our sins into the depths of the sea. You have given truth and unchanging love to us with your Son. (From Micah 7:14-20, New Covenant Paraphrase)

The Lord your God is gracious and compassionate, patient, abounding in lovingkindness. (Joel 2:13)

You are a gracious and compassionate God, patient and overflowing with lovingkindness. (Jonah 4:2)

“I have loved you,” says the Lord. (Malachai 1:2)


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:23 am 
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The LORD, the LORD, the compassionate and gracious God, slow to anger, abounding in love and faithfulness, maintaining love to thousands, and forgiving wickedness, rebellion and sin.


Tribes of Israel only need apply. (No blacks allowed!) Do everything he says otherwise he'll kill you. His love is conditional and so his his compassion. Absolutely no work on the sabbath or it's death on the spot!

Sign on the dotted line. Your life depends on it. Must be able to prove your race and genealogy line of authority in order to get priesthood from Levi. No Jews accepted for priesthood callings at temple.

Women must wear sanitary pads and stay clean! Remain outside the gate until finished. failure to comply may get you leprosy! No talking back to your husbands. Obey them as you would the LORD.

The LORD is so loving

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:39 am 
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Is not Ephraim my dear son, the child in whom I delight? Though I often speak against him, I still remember him. Therefore my heart yearns for him; I have great compassion for him," declares the LORD.


You're a control freak and a despot, Jehovah, losing your temper far too often. Why should Ephraim want to do every little thing you say? Too many dos and don'ts! Too many punishments for every little thing. No wonder Ephraim has a problem and you often speak against him! You're a mean SOB! No wonder nobody likes you.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:45 am 
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I will make an everlasting covenant with them: I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me, so that they will never turn away from me. I will rejoice in doing them good and will assuredly plant them in this land with all my heart and soul.


Well, we all know it's about having FEAR! Fearing Jehovah is the bottom line. That's his number one requirement. We also know that when the people stop fearing him he gets all angry and bent out of shape and starts killing his own people to remind them whose in charge.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 9:30 am 
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mentalgymnast wrote:
Philo Sofee wrote:
This is the thread where I will let MG present verses that either say or show Jehovah is a loving and kind God. I have said and thus will have to meet the demand of providing twice as many verses each and every time MG finds one verse, showing why Jehovah is a monster God, not a kind and loving God as MG claims. Lets see what the actual evidence bears out. If MG wishes to provide an overall philosophical context to the verses he chooses, that is fine, and I am allowed the same fortunate occurrence for context sake. THE main idea is on what does the OT establish, Jehovah as a kind and loving deity or Jehovah as a monster. Lets see what the actual evidence of the scripture called The Old Testament show us the truth as we now have it in writing.


To save a LOT of time we might use the work of others to throw OT verses back and forth and see who 'wins'. By the way, no one can win at this game. Just sayin'''.

I sure don't expect to.

http://rationalchristianity.net/ot_love.html

https://unlockingthebible.org/2018/10/s ... gods-love/

https://love-god-love-others.blogspot.c ... ament.html

https://www.christianforums.com/threads ... t.7648790/

https://livingbydesign.org/gods-grace-i ... testament/

scroll down on this last link

I'll let you count the number of actual scriptures referred to in these links. Then it's off to the races, right? You can list all of your examples of 'monster god'.

Yay.

Now what?

Also, let me post a couple of links from another thread that I think should be taken seriously:

https://carm.org/god-of-old-testament-a-monster

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/scie ... 62936.html

The fact is, we can go back on forth all day on whether or not the God of the OT is a 'monster god' or a 'loving God' and not get anywhere.

I know you would like to and NEED to in order to support your atheism, but I'm not as invested as you are in trying to prove my point made back in this thread:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52192&start=147

starting, I think, somewhere on that page.

I think that we can agree that if there was a literal creator God making Himself known in the OT that he was extremely patient and forgiving...up to a point. An interesting question could be asked (if you're going to take all of the 'monster god' references in the OT at face value), "What would have happened if God had not intervened?"

Would there even be an OT that would be of ANY real value? How would Israel look today? What would be the present condition of Judaism and Christianity?

I think that if there are any winners as we look at the OT as we have it presently, it is those who worship One God in whose image we are created vs. those that worship many gods or no god at all. Without the OT and New Testament attached at the hip, as it were, I think the Christian faith would have become something other than what it is.

Personally, I think that God's hand is in all things. OT creation. OT history/myth. And that in the middle of it all, is His love for His children.

OK. Now have at it. Show that the God of creation is a mean and vindictive God who hates his creations and wants to purposefully do damage so that He can simply get a kick out of it. Not that this even makes sense...

Regards,
MG


*bump for Philo


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:05 am 
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One might make the challenge tougher by distinguishing passages in which God is said to be kind or cruel from passages in which God actually does kind or cruel things. After all the cowed minions of a mob boss are bound to say the Don is kindness personified even if all his actions are vicious.

On the other hand maybe that distinction makes little sense. If one does not assume that the scriptures are somehow authoritative then their descriptions of God's actions and their assertions about God are equally nothing more than things humans have written. It's not as though the prophetic verses about lovingkindness were merely recorded in interviews with God's friends while God's personal launching of plagues has been caught on tape. And if on the other hand the scriptures are authoritative then their statements about God and their accounts of God's actions should be equally reliable.

Back on the first hand, though, even in fiction there's a difference between show and tell. A character who is described as kind by the narrator, or even in dialogue from other characters, is not as vividly kind a character as one who is shown to be kind by their actions.

I think one might say that the Old Testament does more telling that God is kind and loving than it does showing. It praises God in general terms but when it ascribes specific actions to God, those actions are generally violent. There are a few miraculous healings or provisions of food or water, but I think there are rather more plagues and massacres.

At least so I recall. It might be worth checking. Not all the violent events in the Old Testament are ascribed directly to God.


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 10:15 am 
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Thanks, PG. You said what I was thinking, and much more eloquently than I would have.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:04 am 
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Jehovah is a moving target. He exists in the mind of his followers so he evolves over time. I think he starts out as one God among many who makes a special deal with Israel to help them kick ass and take their place in the world but eventually evolves into the one true god, creator of all. His attributes change over time and, for Christians (including Mormons), change though the New Testament as well.

What I think is interesting is that he takes some backward steps in Mormonism in the 1800s. Early Mormons saw God as demanding arbitrary, often sadistic, loyalty tests (Joseph Smith asking for John Taylor and Heber Kimball's wives as an "Abrahamic" test, or even worse with Orson Hyde where he actually took her as his own). Prove your loyalty to God by giving Joseph your wife for eternity!

So we can let early OT God off the hook for his immoral loyalty testing by claiming it didn't really happen as written but we may be throwing Joseph under the bus in doing so. 1800s Mormon God and OT God are both in line with the idea that you need to obey, even if your conscience tells you otherwise.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 11:27 am 
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:lol: Stem, that’s some list. The infamous Wasatch Front passive aggressive language study samples look like they came straight from scripture!
Quote:
...my dear son, the child in whom I delight? Though I often speak against him, I still remember him....

Quote:
...I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me....

Quote:
...show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another and is an adulteress....

This one though...
Quote:
...the Lord loves the Israelites...though they...love the sacred raisin cakes...

I read a LOT of scripture in my youth, but I don’t remember that one! It’s not in the KJV, is it?


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:12 pm 
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Shulem wrote:
huckelberry wrote:
God is death and will take both you and I and our best friends.


I don't mind dying and going when it's my time. But I would be highly offended if I was thrown in a dirt pit and stoned by religious zealots just because I'm a practicing homosexual. That would grieve me and stress me out. Can you imagine being pelted to death with rocks just because you expressed physical pleasure with the person you love?

:cry:


I can see a point you have there.It might have been a good workable idea to move a bit. Egypt, some coastal cities, or perhaps parts north. Attitudes would vary place to place. I suspect there were some word of mouth where safer locations were as there have been down the centuries.

I could add to my previous note that God is also source of life not just death.


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 1:14 pm 
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Lemmie wrote:
:lol: Stem, that’s some list. The infamous Wasatch Front passive aggressive language study samples look like they came straight from scripture!
Quote:
...my dear son, the child in whom I delight? Though I often speak against him, I still remember him....

Quote:
...I will never stop doing good to them, and I will inspire them to fear me....

Quote:
...show your love to your wife again, though she is loved by another and is an adulteress....

This one though...
Quote:
...the Lord loves the Israelites...though they...love the sacred raisin cakes...

I read a LOT of scripture in my youth, but I don’t remember that one! It’s not in the KJV, is it?


:lol: I saw the raisin cakes one and chuckled too. Yeah...don't think it was from the KJV.

Physics Guy wrote:
One might make the challenge tougher by distinguishing passages in which God is said to be kind or cruel from passages in which God actually does kind or cruel things


Oh I agree. As I was going through MG's links and pulling out the passages (and after reading them) I grew tired of how many amount to the passage praising God. I grew tired and just grouped all the Psalms together--because well, theya re just saying, 'you're great God'.


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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 5:43 pm 
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Quote:
MG
You want me to go back to these links posted and extract the readily available scriptures which are listed right in front of your face and start listing them one by one to play your little game?

No thanks.

I can see where you're headed, but it's a dead end. A lot of time wasted to get there.


Agreed, I have better things to do.......

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:21 pm 
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huckelberry wrote:
I can see a point you have there.It might have been a good workable idea to move a bit. Egypt, some coastal cities, or perhaps parts north. Attitudes would vary place to place. I suspect there were some word of mouth where safer locations were as there have been down the centuries.

I could add to my previous note that God is also source of life not just death.


Okay, well, thanks for that. Yeah. I wouldn't have fared well living among the Israelites. You're right in that there were cultures and places that didn't kill gays on sight.

:wink:

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:44 pm 
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Honey pick yourself up a good book on the Greco-Roman culture. There's tons of them.

:-)

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:47 pm 
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Jersey Girl wrote:
Honey pick yourself up a good book on the Greco-Roman culture. There's tons of them.

:-)


I know. I know.

:smile:

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 6:54 pm 
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He knows when I'm talkin' to him without saying his name. ;-)

We like him.

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:02 pm 
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Yep.

:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 7:32 pm 
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Every time I put on a tank top I think of you and the old days before you "turned" gay.

:lol:

Love you.
<3

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 Post subject: Re: A Challenge for Mentalgymnast on Jehovah Being a Monster
PostPosted: Wed Sep 11, 2019 8:05 pm 
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Jersey Girl wrote:
Every time I put on a tank top I think of you and the old days before you "turned" gay.

:lol:

Love you.
<3


I'll never forget that conversation. Ha ha! It was you that told me to drink lots of water when I was drinking and getting drunk on the board. I didn't know that one should drink water when drinking alcohol. Ha ha! It was all new to me. I had some bad bed spins but some damn good drunks while posting. It drove Shades nuts. OMFG! It was fun. I'd go back and do it all over again in a heartbeat.

Ha ha.

:lol:

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