Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

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_kamenraider
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _kamenraider »

I'm sure this is just a publicity stunt to draw attention to him releasing videos of the newly changed temple ordinances. Let's hope it's ONLY a publicity stunt and no actual porn is filmed in temples.
A foolish faith in authority is the worst enemy of truth.
--Albert Einstein
_Lemmie
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Lemmie »

"I'm exmo, out gay man living in Utah, and my teenage children are being raised TBM by my ex-wife with support of my mother and siblings and ex-in-laws. I have been cut off from them.
New Name Noah's latest vulgar stunt has further eroded the progress I've made in being viewed as a reasonable person who just disagrees with Mormon history and treatment of LGBT people. One of my nieces texted this to me today, "I will fight you apostates with every breath in my body to keep your ugly cameras out of the Lord's sacred temples."

And if newnamenoah hadn't done this stunt, this man would still be making "progress" with his family? Apparently, this despicable family has banned him from seeing his children and relatives because of his sexual orientation. That is on them, and no one else. No amount of good behavior from "you apostates" will ever fix the ugliness in their souls.

I think newnamenoahs latest stunt is terrible and wrong. However, there will always be atrocities being done, and it is incomprehensively evil that this man's family behave as they do. Treating him badly because of the actions of another person that he is not responsible for is just more bigotry.

they all think that once we leave the church and become an ex-Mormon, we all turn into people like NewNameNoah-- vulgar, crass, without morals or consideration for other people's feelings or sacred spaces.
This stunt won't change anything. The people who stereotyped "apostates" were bigoted before this stunt, and using this stunt to justify their bigotry is their immorality. Newnamenoah is responsible for his own behavior, but blaming him for other's bigotry is missing the bigger issue.
_Meadowchik
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Meadowchik »

Lemmie, of course a gay person shouldn't be punished because of what NNN is doing. The campaign against conversion therapy in Utah SHOULDN'T be affected, the campaign for hate crimes legislation SHOULDN'T be affected by it. Just like medical marijuana legislation shouldn't be directed by the church, neither should treatment of gays.

We can "should" all day long, but the fact is that perception does matter, on the public and individual level. It impacts and the impact plays and replays. People do respond to triggers. They are susceptible to induced outrage, and to take it out on others.
_Sanctorian
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Sanctorian »

Lemmie nailed it on the head. This “stunt” might allow a closeted bigot to vocalize the evils of “apostasy”, but they were a bigot before and will be a bigot after. This just gave them a reason to say something. That guys family is a bunch of ass holes.
I'm a Ziontologist. I self identify as such.
_Lemmie
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Lemmie »

MC wrote:Lemmie, of course a gay person shouldn't be punished because of what NNN is doing. The campaign against conversion therapy in Utah SHOULDN'T be affected, the campaign for hate crimes legislation SHOULDN'T be affected by it. Just like medical marijuana legislation shouldn't be directed by the church, neither should treatment of gays.

We can "should" all day long, but the fact is that perception does matter, on the public and individual level. It impacts and the impact plays and replays. People do respond to triggers. They are susceptible to induced outrage, and to take it out on others.


I'm not talking about any of that. I am saying that it is not newnamenoah's fault for how the guy is being treated by his family. Based on the given facts, it is their behavior that is wrong, and the stunt is irrelevant.

Eliminating such stunts would do nothing to correct the problem. Arguing that newnamenoah made things worse is also obfuscating the issue.

ETA:
Sanctorian wrote:Lemmie nailed it on the head. This “stunt” might allow a closeted bigot to vocalize the evils of “apostasy”, but they were a bigot before and will be a bigot after. This just gave them a reason to say something. That guys family is a bunch of ass holes.


Exactly. I was already typing a response to Meadowchik when I saw this-- you stated it perfectly!
_Shulem
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Shulem »

Lemmie wrote:
Sanctorian wrote:Lemmie nailed it on the head. This “stunt” might allow a closeted bigot to vocalize the evils of “apostasy”, but they were a bigot before and will be a bigot after. This just gave them a reason to say something. That guys family is a bunch of ass holes.


Exactly. I was already typing a response to Meadowchik when I saw this-- you stated it perfectly!


Yep, you nailed it.

It's hard to please a bigot. A bigot is a bigot.
_Maksutov
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Maksutov »

This NNN dude seems like a revenge porn type. :confused:
"God" is the original deus ex machina. --Maksutov
_Shulem
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Shulem »

WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN?

I'll tell you what I think. I think the church will eventually publish the temple ceremonies in a special church produced study manual whereby the public and the members may be fully informed about what takes place in the temple. No more secrets -- just sacred. Members will be able to read and memorize the ceremony prior to going to the temple to perform the actual ordinances. The mystery of Mormon temple secrets will vanish and the public at large will brush it off as something they aren't interested in but will appreciate having the right to know.

This is what the church should do. This is what the church must do. This is what the church will do. If the church is going to survive in an international environment it is going to have to be more transparent.

Watch.
_Shulem
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Shulem »

Maksutov wrote:This NNN dude seems like a revenge porn type. :confused:


Are you going to check it out?

I think you will.

:wink:
_Fence Sitter
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Re: Mike Norton to sneak into temple to film porn?

Post by _Fence Sitter »

Shulem wrote:WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN?

I'll tell you what I think. I think the church will eventually publish the temple ceremonies in a special church produced study manual whereby the public and the members may be fully informed about what takes place in the temple. No more secrets -- just sacred. Members will be able to read and memorize the ceremony prior to going to the temple to perform the actual ordinances. The mystery of Mormon temple secrets will vanish and the public at large will brush it off as something they aren't interested in but will appreciate having the right to know.

This is what the church should do. This is what the church must do. This is what the church will do. If the church is going to survive in an international environment it is going to have to be more transparent.

Watch.


Paul,

I've stayed out of this thread because I think it's so self evident that this is a bad idea that it was not worth discussing. That said I would like to point out that this comment by you is highly unlikely. The number one thing that the church has going for it is controlling access to and information about the temple. This is their primary means of controlling the masses and milking them for time and money. Why do you think they are increasing the rate they are building them in the spite of decreasing growth?

They are not going to make access and information about the temple more common. They will just use idiotic stunts like this as an example of why members should not look at the internet for information.
Stuff like this makes it more difficult for those of us who are still looking for constructive dialogue with our TBM friends and family.
"Any over-ritualized religion since the dawn of time can make its priests say yes, we know, it is rotten, and hard luck, but just do as we say, keep at the ritual, stick it out, give us your money and you'll end up with the angels in heaven for evermore."
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