New Jaredite Publication

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_The Dude
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _The Dude »

toon wrote:Looks like Game of Thrones fan theories.


Allow me to propose and explore the concept of identifying Gazelem as a Jedi Knight....
"And yet another little spot is smoothed out of the echo chamber wall..." Bond
_grindael
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _grindael »

It is simply a made up word... so obvious... a variant of GAZE-AT-EM! The Peeker loved hunting for his buried treasure and wrote about it in his fictional work. Slippery treasures and all. Josiah Stowell in 1826:

Says that prisoner had been at his house something like five months. Had been employed by him to work on farm part of time; that he pretended to have skill of telling where hidden treasures in the earth were, by means of looking through a certain stone; that prisoner had looked for him sometimes, - once to tell him about money buried on Bend Mountain in Pennsylvania, once for gold on Monument Hill, and once for a salt-spring, - and that he positively knew that the prisoner could tell, and professed the art of seeing those valuable treasures through the medium of said stone: that he found the digging part at Bend and Monument Hill as prisoner represented it; that prisoner had looked through said stone for Deacon Attelon, for a mine - did not exactly find it, but got a piece of ore, which resembled gold, he thinks; that prisoner had told by means of this stone where a Mr. Bacon had buried money; that he and prisoner had been in search of it; that prisoner said that it was in a certain root of a stump five feet from surface of the earth, and with it would be found a tail-feather; that said Stowel and prisoner thereupon commenced digging, found a tail-feather, but money was gone; that he supposed that money moved down; that prisoner did not offer his services; that he never deceived him; that prisoner looked through stone, and described Josiah Stowel's house and out-houses while at Palmyra, at Simpson Stowel's, correctly; that he had told about a painted tree with a man's hand painted upon it, by means of said stone; that he had been in company with prisoner digging for gold, and had the most implicit faith in prisoner's skill."


Jonathan Thompson says that prisoner was requested to look Yeomans for chest of money; did look, and pretended to know where it was, and that prisoner, Thompson, and Yeomans went in search of it; that Smith arrived at spot first (was in night); that Smith looked in hat while there, and when very dark, and told how the chest was situated. After digging several feet, struck upon something sounding like a board or plank. Prisoner would not look again, pretending that he was alarmed the last time that he looked, on account of the circumstances relating to the trunk being buried came all fresh to his mind; that the last time that he looked, he discovered distinctly the two Indians who buried the trunk; that a quarrel ensued between them, and that one of said Indians was killed by the other, and thrown into the hole beside of the trunk, to guard it, as he supposed. Thompson says that he believes in the prisoner's professed skill; that the board which he struck his spade upon was probably the chest, but, on account of an enchantment, the trunk kept settling away from under them while digging; that, notwithstanding they continued constantly removing the dirt, yet the trunk kept about the same distance from them. Says prisoner said that it appeared to him that salt might be found at Bainbridge; and that he is certain that prisoner can divine things by means of said stone and hat; that, as evidence of fact, prisoner looked into his hat to tell him about some money witness lost sixteen years ago, and that he described the man that witness supposed had taken it, and disposition of money."


I will prepare unto my servant Gazelem a stone which shall shine forth in darkness unto light, that I may discover unto my people which serve me —that I may discover unto them the works of their brethren, yea, their secret works, their works of darkness, and their wickedness and abominations.


But a seer can know of things which are passed, and also of things which are to come; and by them shall all things be revealed — or rather shall secret things be made manifest — and hidden things shall come to light, and things which is not known shall be made known by them, and also things shall be made known by them [Page 95]which otherwise could not be known. (Mosiah 8:17)


So how were the 116 pages lost again? How did Smith not know they would be lost? Oh yeah, it only worked for "slippery treasures". Yet Smith himself testified,

With some labor and exertion he found the stone...placed it in his hat, and discovered that time, place and distance were annihilated; that all intervening obstacles were removed, and that he possessed one of the attributes of Deity, an All-Seeing-Eye.


And yet Jo did not know there were three men waiting to take away his Gold Bible when he supposedly dug it out of the hill near his home. When it was necessary for Jo to make use of his peepstone, he didn't.

Let's not forget that all this goes hand in hand. These speculations about the content of the Book are silly.

GAZELEM
Lehite PN or common noun 1. A servant of God, or stone directors/interpreters. (Alma 37:23).
Etymology

Lehite prophetic name for a future “servant” of God (Gazelam = Joseph Smith in D&C 78:9, etc.), or of stone “directors” (Alma 37:21, 24, O P mss 1830-1911 eds > “interpreters” in 1920 1981 eds.), depending on whether the word within the phrase is read as an appositive to the preceding noun or as the noun of the following appositive (Alma 37:23).

An etymology based on North-west Semitic gzl, gṣl, ǵzl or ǵṣl would be the most likely, with a dual ending -êm.[1] The dual ending would tend to reinforce reading GAZELEM as the noun of the following appositive, because the “directors”/“interpreters” consisted of two (=dual) stones set in a silver bow.[2]

Because “r” and “l” are both “liquid” consonants, they often interchange from one language to another, such as between HEBREW and EGYPTIAN.[3] Therefore it would not be amiss to derive from Semitic gzr, yielding a very attractive etymology along the lines of biblical Aramaic gāzrîn, the “deciders/determiners (of fate),” used for the Babylonian magi (Daniel 2:27; 4:4; 5:7, 11). This root is represented in biblical HEBREW by gzr “cut, divide; decree (fate)” (Isaiah 9:19; 2 Nephi 19:10, Isaiah 53:8; Job 22:28).

Such terms may be related to Cypriote Maronite Arabic xazra, “stone.” gzar, “stones.”[4] Cf. HEBREW gĕzārîm, “halves” in Genesis 15:17; Psalms 136:13, from gzr, “cut in two” (1 Kings 3:25) or “polishing, beauty” (Lamentations 4:7).

Another possible etymology could employ Ugaritic gùzr (pl. gùzrm), “young man, warrior, hero”[5] >azara/ta>azra (meaning uncertain - either “to launch an attack,” or “to be scattered, be routed, pour forth”)[6]; Arabic gùazura “to be much, be abundant”; adj. gùazeµr “much, plentiful.”[7]

Also promising is the suggestion that the name comes from ʿāz, “might,” and ʿelem, “young man” (JH), if ʿāz comes from ģzz and ʿelem comes from ʿlm.

Less likely are readings from the Arabic root for “gazelle,” ģzl, the initial syllable as the root gzh or gzz, having to do with cutting and shearing (JH). Reynolds and Sjodahl[8] suggest possibly HEBREW *gāz-ʿālêm, or gazê-ʿalem (V???), “cut-stones of the Most High,” from gzh, “cut, hew” (cf. ’ăbnê-gāzît, “hewed stones, squared stones” in 1 Kings 5:17; 6:36; 7:9, 11, 12; Exodus 20:25; Isaiah 9:9, 10‖2 Nephi 19:10) + ‘alem (V???), “(he who is) on high”? Or *ga-ṣelem, “exalted image, magnificent likeness,” from gāʾā, “exalted, glorious, proud, magnificent” (Exodus 15:1, 21) + ṣelem, “image, likeness.”

See URIAH, SHELEM, ALMA, ETHER.

Variants

There are no variations of this name in the Book of Mormon text, but there are other spellings outside the Book of Mormon: Gazelum Orson Pratt, John Dehlin, 16:156 (16 Aug 1873); Gazelam 1835 D&C (6xx), D. J. Whittaker, “Substituted Names in the Published Revelations of Joseph Smith,” BYU Studies, 23/1 (1983):103-112. https://onoma.lib.byu.edu/index.php/GAZELEM


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_Kishkumen
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _Kishkumen »

Gaze-at-‘em? With all due respect, grindael, that explanation is wholly inadequate.
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_zeezrom
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _zeezrom »

Kishkumen wrote:Looks like a bullseye to me!

Kish, it is with great pleasure that I consider the small yet humble contribution I might have stumbled upon that aids in your efforts of unearthing the secrets of the ancient Jaredite Nation. It's only a matter of time before that "seal" is broken by the works of great researchers like yourself.
Oh for shame, how the mortals put the blame on us gods, for they say evils come from us, but it is they, rather, who by their own recklessness win sorrow beyond what is given... Zeus (1178 BC)

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_grindael
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _grindael »

Kishkumen wrote:Gaze-at-‘em? With all due respect, grindael, that explanation is wholly inadequate.


All such speculations usually are. :smile:

What we do know is that Smith put this name in the Book of Mormon (with a slight variant spelling) with a claim that it would be a person who would use a "stone" and that he later identified himself as that very person by applying the name to himself in other "revelations". And these were considered revelations where God supposedly calls Smith by that name. That's the simple explanation.

2. And now, verily thus saith the Lord, it is expedient that all things be done unto my glory, that ye should, who are joined together in this order; or in other words, let my servant Ahasdah, and my servant Gazelam, or Enoch, and my servant Pelagoram, sit in council with the saints which are in Zion; otherwise satan seeketh to turn their hearts away from the truth, that they become blinded, and understand not the things which are prepared for them: wherefore a commandment I give unto you, to prepare and organize yourselves by a bond or everlasting covenant that cannot be broken.


4. Therefore, verily I say unto you, that it is expedient for my servant Alam and Ahashdah, Mahalaleel and Pelagoram, and my servant Gazelam, and Horah, and Olihah, and Shalemanasseh, and Mehemson, be bound together by a bond and covenant that cannot be broken by transgression except judgment shall immediately follow, in your several stewardships, to manage the affairs of the poor, and all things pertaining to the bishopric both in the land of Zion, and in the land of Shinehah, for I have consecrated the land of Shinehah in mine own due time for the benefit of the saints of the Most High, and for a stake to Zion: for Zion must increase in beauty, and in holiness: her borders must be enlarged; her stakes must be strengthened: yea, verily I say unto you, Zion must arise and put on her beautiful garments: therefore I give unto you this commandment, that ye bind yourselves by this covenant, and it shall be done according to the laws of the Lord.


4. And again, let my servant Mahemson have appointed unto him, for his stewardship, the lot of the land which my servant Zombre obtained in exchange for his former inheritance, for him and his seed after him; and inasmuch as he is faithful I will multiply blessings upon him and his seed after him. And let my servant Mahemson devote his moneys for the proclaiming of my words, according as my servant Gazelam shall direct.

5. And again, let my servant Shederlaomach have the place upon which he now dwells. And let my servant Olihah have the lot which is set off joining the house which is to be for the Lane-shine- house, which is lot number one: and also the lot upon which his father resides. And let my servant Shederlaomach and Olihah have the Lane-shine-house and all things that pertain unto it; and this shall be their stewardship which shall be appointed unto them; and inasmuch as they are faithful, behold I will bless, and multiply blessings upon them: and this is the beginning of the stewardship which I have appointed them, for them and their seed after them; and inasmuch as they are faithful, I will multiply blessings upon them and their seed after them; even a multiplicity of blessings.

6. And again, let my servant Zombre have the house in which he lives, and the inheritance, all save the ground which has been reserved for the building of my houses, which pertains to that inheritance; and those lots which have been named for my servant Olihah. And inasmuch as he is faithful, I will multiply blessings upon him. And it is my will that he should sell the lots that are laid off for the building up of the city of my saints, inasmuch as it shall be made known to him by the voice of the Spirit, and according to the counsel of the order; and by the voice of the order. And this is the beginning of the stewardship which I have appointed unto him, for a blessing unto him, and his seed after him; and inasmuch as he is faithful, I will multiply a multiplicity of blessings upon him.

7. And again, let my servant Ahashdah have appointed unto him, the houses and lot where he now resides, and the lot and building on which the Ozondah stands; and also the lot which is on the corner south of the Ozondah; and also the lot on which the Shule is situated: And all this I have appointed unto my servant Ahashdah, for his stewardship, for a blessing upon him and his seed after him, for the benefit of the Ozondah of my order, which I have established for my stake in the land of Shinehah; yea, verily this is the stewardship which I have appointed unto my servant Ahashdah; even this whole Ozondah establishment, him and his agent, and his seed after him, and inasmuch as he is faithful in keeping my commandments, which I have given unto him, I will multiply blessings upon him, and his seed after him, even a multiplicity of blessings.

8. And again, let my servant Gazelam have appointed unto him, the lot which is laid off for the building of my house, which is forty rods long, and twelve wide, and also the inheritance upon which his father now resides; and this is the beginning of the stewardship which I have appointed unto him, for a blessing upon him, and upon his father, for behold, I Have reserved an inheritance for his father, for his support: therefore he shall be reckoned in the house of my servant Gazelam; and I will multiply blessings upon the house of my servant Gazelam, inasmuch as he is faithful, even a multiplicity of blessings.


Any thoughts on the rest of these made up names? Or that it meant "Enoch", since Jo identifies himself as Gazelam or Enoch? Considering his track record and the alternate spelling in the D&C, perhaps Jo was trying to give us a message? His "all seeing eye" GAZE was LAME? Or perhaps his spectacles were the wrong prescription? After all, in 1826 he said,

...he had occasionally been in the habit of looking through this stone to find lost property for three years, but of late had pretty much given it up on account its injuring his health, especially his eyes - made them sore...


Ocasionally? Yet his Da testified about,
...his wonderful triumphs as a seer. He described very many instances of his finding hidden and stolen goods...


John Johnson was one bad Zombre... :twisted: Perhaps a hidden prophecy about the Walking Dead?
Riding on a speeding train; trapped inside a revolving door;
Lost in the riddle of a quatrain; Stuck in an elevator between floors.
One focal point in a random world can change your direction:
One step where events converge may alter your perception.
_Kishkumen
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _Kishkumen »

zeezrom wrote:
Kishkumen wrote:Looks like a bullseye to me!

Kish, it is with great pleasure that I consider the small yet humble contribution I might have stumbled upon that aids in your efforts of unearthing the secrets of the ancient Jaredite Nation. It's only a matter of time before that "seal" is broken by the works of great researchers like yourself.


Only with the important contributions of keen-eyed and diligent scholars such as yourself, Dr. Zeezrom.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
_Kishkumen
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _Kishkumen »

grindael wrote:
Kishkumen wrote:Gaze-at-‘em? With all due respect, grindael, that explanation is wholly inadequate.


All such speculations usually are. :smile:

What we do know is that Smith put this name in the Book of Mormon (with a slight variant spelling) with a claim that it would be a person who would use a "stone" and that he later identified himself as that very person by applying the name to himself in other "revelations". And these were considered revelations where God supposedly calls Smith by that name. That's the simple explanation.


I can get on board with the "gaze" part as an obvious English borrowing based on its meaning "to see" and I am fine with the self-referential nature of the name. Then again, if Smith could be Enoch and Gazelem, then it may be he was happy to assume the names of other people from the past, real or fictional. My main disagreement with "gaze-at-'em" is that there is no "t" in Gazelem. That may sound like a picky point, but Joseph's imaginative etymologies and wordplay were usually more faithful to the sounds of the words he was referencing.

Mor-mon as More + Egyptian "mon", maybe "more money"? "Zelph" = self. These are discarded ideas of formerly ex-Mormon historian Don Bradley, as speculated when he was not a believing Mormon.

Now, Gazelem would make more sense to me as "gaze" + "El"= to see God, or maybe even "gaze" + "Elohim" contracted to "Elem." This would work especially well for a Jaredite seer or a Jaredite stone in the tradition of Mahonri Moriancumr.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
_moksha
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _moksha »

Kishkumen wrote:
toon wrote:Looks like Game of Thrones fan theories.

How so?

In that Gazelem was actually time traveling Joseph Smith with his illuminating stone and 24 plates of Dragon Glass and that he was sent to stop the latter-day White Walkers from invading Westeros from the Land North of the Rio Grande.
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_DonBradley
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _DonBradley »

Kishkumen wrote:
Mor-mon as More + Egyptian "mon", maybe "more money"? "Zelph" = self. These are discarded ideas of formerly ex-Mormon historian Don Bradley, as speculated when he was not a believing Mormon.


Kish,

I imagine that you're distancing these ideas from my present self out of a desire to not saddle me with negative ideas about Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon. I appreciate that. And it is certainly the case that I don't have the same paradigm I did at the time we first discussed these ideas. But the above largely mischaracterizes how I shift from one model to another across time.

While it is very much the case that I have abandoned the view of Joseph Smith as opportunist, that doesn't mean that I have abandoned all the connections I originally made under that paradigm. Rather than abandoning these connections, in most cases I've recontextualized them in a larger model that acknowledges the connections but sees their meaning as more complex than I once did.

The first of these ideas had to do with how the name Mormon would strike a certain member of the book's dictation audience. It was an overly simplistic explanation of the name Mormon. But that doesn't mean the name didn't strike the audience member in precisely that way.

The second is an idea about which I have no doubt: "Zelph" was meant to evoke "self."
_Kishkumen
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Re: New Jaredite Publication

Post by _Kishkumen »

DonBradley wrote:I imagine that you're distancing these ideas from my present self out of a desire to not saddle me with negative ideas about Joseph Smith and the Book of Mormon. I appreciate that. And it is certainly the case that I don't have the same paradigm I did at the time we first discussed these ideas. But the above largely mischaracterizes how I shift from one model to another across time.

While it is very much the case that I have abandoned the view of Joseph Smith as opportunist, that doesn't mean that I have abandoned all the connections I originally made under that paradigm. Rather than abandoning these connections, in most cases I've recontextualized them in a larger model that acknowledges the connections but sees their meaning as more complex than I once did.

The first of these ideas had to do with how the name Mormon would strike a certain member of the book's dictation audience. It was an overly simplistic explanation of the name Mormon. But that doesn't mean the name didn't strike the audience member in precisely that way.

The second is an idea about which I have no doubt: "Zelph" was meant to evoke "self."


Thanks for dropping by to straighten out any misperceptions.
"Petition wasn’t meant to start a witch hunt as I’ve said 6000 times." ~ Hanna Seariac, LDS apologist
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