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 Post subject: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:18 am 
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Hurricane Irma is currently on a direct path towards Florida and depending on when a high pressure system moves, will determine when Irma will be able to turn from an West by Northwest trajectory to a North by northeast path.

So I propose a test of the Power of Prayer. I suggest that those who believe in the power of prayer to pray with all of their might to what ever God they believe in to move that high pressure system NOW thus allowing Irma to turn North thus avoiding the hurricane from making contact with Florida and the American continent.

However this test come with a risk. If Irma fails to turn...and does follow it's current projected course into Florida...it will also demonstrate the futility of Prayer.

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:28 am 
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:rolleyes:


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:31 am 
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Craig Paxton wrote:
Hurricane Irma is currently on a direct path towards Florida and depending on when a high pressure system moves, will determine when Irma will be able to turn from an West by Northwest trajectory to a North by northeast path.

So I propose a test of the Power of Prayer. I suggest that those who believe in the power of prayer to pray with all of their might to what ever God they believe in to move that high pressure system NOW thus allowing Irma to turn North thus avoiding the hurricane from making contact with Florida and the American continent.

However this test come with a risk. If Irma fails to turn...and does follow it's current projected course into Florida...it will also demonstrate the futility of Prayer.

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.


:lol:
Pretty sure you are in violation of many guidelines given by the Lord concerning prayer.

- 2 Nephi 4:35 Yea, I know that God will give liberally to him that asketh. Yea, my God will give me, if I ask not amiss; therefore I will lift up my voice unto thee; yea, I will cry unto thee, my God, the rock of my righteousness. Behold, my voice shall forever ascend up unto thee, my rock and mine everlasting God. Amen.

- James 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

- D&C 8:10 Remember that without faith you can do nothing; therefore ask in faith. Trifle not with these things; do not ask for that which you ought not.

- D&C 88:64 Whatsoever ye ask the Father in my name it shall be given unto you, that is expedient for you;
65 And if ye ask anything that is not expedient for you, it shall turn unto your condemnation.

But maybe you're a much more perfect person than I'm giving you credit for and D&C 50 would apply:
- D&C 50:29 And if ye are purified and cleansed from all sin, ye shall ask whatsoever you will in the name of Jesus and it shall be done.


But then maybe we can use your test to learn something.
I have a testimony of Christ. Perhaps I should prophesy in the name of the Lord that your amiss prayer will go unfulfilled.
When it does, that will prove me a prophet won't it?
Too bad I don't like to play sacrilegious games...

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:35 am 
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Mother nature is the god of this earth. Mormon god, Christian god, Muslim god, and all the other gods can't do a thing with regards to Irma. They neither see, nor hear, or walk. They are merely gods of the imagination.

The Mormon prophets are an utter joke. They neither prophesy, they see not the future, and they have no special revelations that can be verified. Their prayers to thwart mother nature are nothing more than the workings of a frenzied mind believing in something they do not see -- only faith in something they hope for.

They pray as if it's a crapshoot and when they win they claim a miracle and when they lose they claim it's god's will to test them. What a joke!

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:43 am 
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JLHPROF wrote:
But then maybe we can use your test to learn something.
I have a testimony of Christ. Perhaps I should prophesy in the name of the Lord that your amiss prayer will go unfulfilled.
When it does, that will prove me a prophet won't it?
Too bad I don't like to play sacrilegious games...


How telling! I believe you DO love to play sacrilegious games but are afraid to admit it and even more afraid to do so. What, are you afraid it will offend the Spirit and displease the Lord?

The spirit of the devil has already come among you. You might as well give in. It's too late for you. The well is poisoned. The Holy Ghost is not abiding in you. You have the spirit of contention. Your testimony days are numbered. You'll break. I know it.

:lol:

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 11:49 am 
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Craig Paxton wrote:
Hurricane Irma is currently on a direct path towards Florida and depending on when a high pressure system moves, will determine when Irma will be able to turn from an West by Northwest trajectory to a North by northeast path.

So I propose a test of the Power of Prayer. I suggest that those who believe in the power of prayer to pray with all of their might to what ever God they believe in to move that high pressure system NOW thus allowing Irma to turn North thus avoiding the hurricane from making contact with Florida and the American continent.

However this test come with a risk. If Irma fails to turn...and does follow it's current projected course into Florida...it will also demonstrate the futility of Prayer.

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.


Great test! And it worked for me. I live here in Sweden and Irma won't come close to Sweden. Conclusion: prayer works

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:40 pm 
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Hey Harvey victims!!!
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Last edited by SteelHead on Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:47 pm 
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I have a better test.

Group 1 - Say prayers and donate money to the effort.
Group 2 - Do not say prayers and donate money to the effort.

See if recipients favour the Group 1’s donations.

This test will work better if everyone takes part.

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― Daniel Kahneman, Nobel Prize Winner, 'Thinking, Fast and Slow'


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 1:53 pm 
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JLHPROF wrote:
Craig Paxton wrote:
Hurricane Irma is currently on a direct path towards Florida and depending on when a high pressure system moves, will determine when Irma will be able to turn from an West by Northwest trajectory to a North by northeast path.

So I propose a test of the Power of Prayer. I suggest that those who believe in the power of prayer to pray with all of their might to what ever God they believe in to move that high pressure system NOW thus allowing Irma to turn North thus avoiding the hurricane from making contact with Florida and the American continent.

However this test come with a risk. If Irma fails to turn...and does follow it's current projected course into Florida...it will also demonstrate the futility of Prayer.

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.


:lol:
Pretty sure you are in violation of many guidelines given by the Lord concerning prayer.

- 2 Nephi 4:35 Yea, I know that God will give liberally to him that asketh. Yea, my God will give me, if I ask not amiss; therefore I will lift up my voice unto thee; yea, I will cry unto thee, my God, the rock of my righteousness. Behold, my voice shall forever ascend up unto thee, my rock and mine everlasting God. Amen.

- James 4:3 Ye ask, and receive not, because ye ask amiss, that ye may consume it upon your lusts.

- D&C 8:10 Remember that without faith you can do nothing; therefore ask in faith. Trifle not with these things; do not ask for that which you ought not.

- D&C 88:64 Whatsoever ye ask the Father in my name it shall be given unto you, that is expedient for you;
65 And if ye ask anything that is not expedient for you, it shall turn unto your condemnation.

But maybe you're a much more perfect person than I'm giving you credit for and D&C 50 would apply:
- D&C 50:29 And if ye are purified and cleansed from all sin, ye shall ask whatsoever you will in the name of Jesus and it shall be done.


But then maybe we can use your test to learn something.
I have a testimony of Christ. Perhaps I should prophesy in the name of the Lord that your amiss prayer will go unfulfilled.
When it does, that will prove me a prophet won't it?
Too bad I don't like to play sacrilegious games...


Quote:
"What things soever ye desire, when ye pray, believe that ye receive them, and ye shall have them” (Mark 11:24).


I might add...that I desire Florida and the rest of America to be spared...and I pray god that it happens...

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"...What many people call sin is not sin." - Joseph Smith


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:11 pm 
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UPDATE: I've been praying all after noon for Irma to change course and head North-East away from the American continent..so far my prayers and the prayers of millions of others are having no effect on the hurricane's present course...please prayer harder...that MUST be the problem

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"...What many people call sin is not sin." - Joseph Smith


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:24 pm 
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Craig Paxton wrote:
UPDATE: I've been praying all after noon for Irma to change course and head North-East away from the American continent..so far my prayers and the prayers of millions of others are having no effect on the hurricane's present course...please prayer harder...that MUST be the problem


Or not.

Regards,
MG

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Some people make stuff up. Even here on a board like this. Go figure. What is kind of silly, in a way, is that it would take me so long to figure that out. Maybe I didn't want to think it was true. Maybe I give too much the 'benefit of a doubt' to other people. I guess I should know better.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45503


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:30 pm 
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Craig Paxton wrote:

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.


Good luck with that. I think you're going to be disappointed. Unless, by chance, the storm takes a path that is non-destructive to the extreme. Let's hope that is the case.

And like IHAQ said, let's do what we can do to help.

I think you'll come through this as agnostic as ever. :wink:

Oh, prayer can't hurt either.

Regards,
MG

_________________
Some people make stuff up. Even here on a board like this. Go figure. What is kind of silly, in a way, is that it would take me so long to figure that out. Maybe I didn't want to think it was true. Maybe I give too much the 'benefit of a doubt' to other people. I guess I should know better.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45503


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:31 pm 
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Craig Paxton wrote:
...I desire Florida and the rest of America to be spared...and I pray god that it happens...


That's nice. I don't think you are alone.

Regards,
MG

_________________
Some people make stuff up. Even here on a board like this. Go figure. What is kind of silly, in a way, is that it would take me so long to figure that out. Maybe I didn't want to think it was true. Maybe I give too much the 'benefit of a doubt' to other people. I guess I should know better.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=45503


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:38 pm 
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It would be ridiculously simple to test the power of prayer in Mormonism.

Set up a test that involved a large group of patients with a similar serious disease, prognosis, age and whatever. Divide the group into two. Submit the patients names from one group to the temple, daily for a period of time, then compare the groups to see if there is any difference in outcome.

Rinse repeat a few times with various diseases and groups.

It ought to be clear if prayer has any affect.

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:44 pm 
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Fence Sitter wrote:
It would be ridiculously simple to test the power of prayer in Mormonism.

Set up a test that involved a large group of patients with a similar serious disease, prognosis, age and whatever. Divide the group into two. Submit the patients names from one group to the temple, daily for a period of time, then compare the groups to see if there is any difference in outcome.

Rinse repeat a few times with various diseases and groups.

It ought to be clear if prayer has any affect.


Haha brilliant...better yet take two test groups of recently diognosed TBM patients with similar conditions. Tell the group that group A will have their names added to the daily temple prayer roll while group B will not receive any prayers but will receive the very best medical treatment available...then have the patients self decide which group they wish to be put in. Prayer or treatment

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:37 pm 
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mentalgymnast wrote:
Craig Paxton wrote:

Let the test begin...we will soon discover if Prayer Works...and if it does I'm willing to reexamine my conclusions on the existence of God.


Good luck with that. I think you're going to be disappointed. Unless, by chance, the storm takes a path that is non-destructive to the extreme. Let's hope that is the case.

And like IHAQ said, let's do what we can do to help.

I think you'll come through this as agnostic as ever. :wink:

Oh, prayer can't hurt either.

Regards,
MG


Can't hurt, but doesn't help either..... Not much value to it.

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Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 2:09 am 
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Craig Paxton wrote:
UPDATE: I've been praying all after noon for Irma to change course and head North-East away from the American continent..so far my prayers and the prayers of millions of others are having no effect on the hurricane's present course...please prayer harder...that MUST be the problem
Jeremiah 15:

1 Then said the Lord unto me [Jeremiah], Though Moses and Samuel stood before me [in prayer], yet my mind could not be toward this people: cast them out of my sight, and let them go forth.
2 And it shall come to pass, if they say unto thee, Whither shall we go forth? then thou shalt tell them, Thus saith the Lord; Such as are for death, to death; and such as are for the sword, to the sword; and such as are for the famine, to the famine; and such as are for the captivity, to the captivity, [and such as are for the hurricane, to the hurricane].


When God's mind is made up, prayer no longer works.

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 6:30 am 
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mentalgymnast wrote:
Craig Paxton wrote:
...I desire Florida and the rest of America to be spared...and I pray god that it happens...


That's nice. I don't think you are alone.

Regards,
MG


he's not alone, but we all already know God won't do a thing to change the hurricanes course. God doesn't care who gets killed or loses property or hurt. All he does is the damage.

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:00 am 
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Philo Sofee wrote:
he's not alone, but we all already know God won't do a thing to change the hurricanes course. God doesn't care who gets killed or loses property or hurt. All he does is the damage.



***WARNING GRAPHIC IMAGE***


















The horrific images of tsunami victims is enough to convince me that the so-called loving god sitting atop of his throne in yonder heaven is an absolute joke. People of all walks of life are destroyed on planet earth through the rages of nature just as animals are -- the circle of life is all about nature and natural consequences of living in a mortal world. One may safely discard the belief of god and live their life to the fullest in the best way they can. The religious cults in the world have absolutely nothing that appeals to me. I've said it before, Mormonism is nothing but a disease, an infection on the mind and heart that takes one away from reality and self fulfillment. Serving the church and the prophet is all that matters to Mormons, everything else is secondary, although they claim otherwise, their loyalty to church leaders is the foundation of their religion and that is where their money and mouth is. Everything else is just window dressing and dreams.




Image

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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:05 am 
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zerinus wrote:
Craig Paxton wrote:
UPDATE: I've been praying all after noon for Irma to change course and head North-East away from the American continent..so far my prayers and the prayers of millions of others are having no effect on the hurricane's present course...please prayer harder...that MUST be the problem
Jeremiah 15:

1 Then said the Lord unto me [Jeremiah], Though Moses and Samuel stood before me [in prayer], yet my mind could not be toward this people: cast them out of my sight, and let them go forth.
2 And it shall come to pass, if they say unto thee, Whither shall we go forth? then thou shalt tell them, Thus saith the Lord; Such as are for death, to death; and such as are for the sword, to the sword; and such as are for the famine, to the famine; and such as are for the captivity, to the captivity, [and such as are for the hurricane, to the hurricane].


When God's mind is made up, prayer no longer works.


Mind made up or not made up, prayer doesn't work. Send your money to help, not your prayers.

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Some of us, on the other hand, actually prefer a religion that includes some type of correlation with reality.
~Bill Hamblin


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 Post subject: Re: A Test on The POWER of Prayer
PostPosted: Fri Sep 08, 2017 7:52 am 
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zerinus wrote:
When God's mind is made up, prayer no longer works.


Your God has matters upon which He is undecided? Tell us more...

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“A reliable way to make people believe in falsehoods is frequent repetition, because familiarity is not easily distinguished from truth. Authoritarian institutions and marketers have always known this fact.”
― Daniel Kahneman, Nobel Prize Winner, 'Thinking, Fast and Slow'


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