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 Post subject: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:10 pm 
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http://www.mormonstories.org/scott-gord ... mon-smear/

Dear Scott Gordon (President of FAIRMormon),
Since you chose to publicly smear/malign me in a disingenuous way during your recent trip to Europe on multiple occasions (as has been reported to me by multiple sources — see video link below), I would like to ask you to do five things as a courtesy to me, and as a way to demonstrate your credibility to your followers....

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:39 pm 
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Wow. I had no idea Mr. Gordon was such a turd monster.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:43 pm 
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Gordon is generally an okay egg.

Dehlin needs to just shut the hell up. He makes every issue about him, hence why the messenger continues to receive attention. His ego is insane.

Dehlin has done a bunch of good but at the same time he is most def a dildo.

Edited, to say, I am glad anytime Mormon history and current issues are exposed. Dehlin helped push it along with his podcast.


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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:09 pm 
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Look. I know have known John personally. John has long believed there is no God. This is just plain true. I heard him say it many many times.

In the linked post John starts out by publicly getting after Gordon for falsely claiming that Gordon knows John well enough to know that John has long believed there is no God. I can't tell you how many times the two of them have interacted personally as Gordon claims. I can tell you that Gordon was accurately representing John's beliefs. John likes to play false victim. Does it a lot.

In a nutshell, John just says publicly whatever meets his needs. It's a strange experience to work with him and watch him publicly spew so many lies. If he says a website has been hacked, don't believe it. If he says he's not involved in something, don't believe it. Pretty much don't believe anything he says about what's going on and you're set. As long as you know that he lies publicly without batting an eyelash and you don't count on anything he says to be true (or even to be what he believes to be true), it's all good.

Problem is, he attacks and hurts a lot of other people with his lies so it's hard for people anywhere near him to cope with it. He uses the power of media and his followers to win. He falsely attacks and they follow. It is very difficult to be on the receiving end of that kind of danger. i had no idea how to manage his attacks of me because I knew that if I tried to take him on at the time, he'd just lie and manipulate people. The best thing I could think of to do after I had done what I could to keep the whole thing from spinning out of control and had failed was to wait and allow him to follow through with all his plans because I knew that at some point I'd be able to show people what had happened and that John would have already provided the proof I needed. Any other action I could think of at the time would only have hurt progressive Mormons more than John's dishonesty was already hurting them.

Interesting thing, though: I was talking to my son about what John's done to the church recently. My son knows too much about the guy (looks like my son is going to turn out to be a writer so in 20 years y'all may get to hear some of these stories from his pov, idk) and thinks John's a terrible person. He's very disgusted by John's narcissism and dishonesty. That said, my son is still glad John is getting the church.

Me? Idk. I just wish John would at least be big enough to fight suicide contagion. Nobody should die over this cause. The Internet is going to take care of it regardless of John. It's not all about him.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:11 pm 
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lostindc wrote:

Dehlin needs to just shut the hell up. He makes every issue about him, hence why the messenger continues to receive attention. His ego is insane.



True. But maybe not this time...Dehlin did not make this about himself until S. Gordon made it about John Dehlin, calling him out by name. Try to be fair about it. If Gordon had not called out Dehlin by name I think your argument would be stronger.

These guys have to know this is going to blow up in their face. The church is their own worst enemy.

Carry on.

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Last edited by cwald on Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 5:13 pm 
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At the time of the Smith hit piece, John absolutely claimed to believe in a god...probably even the Mormon God.

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Last edited by cwald on Wed Jul 13, 2016 8:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:29 pm 
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cwald wrote:
At the time of the Gordon hit piece, John absolutely claimed to believe in a god...probably even the Mormon God.


Publicly, not privately.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:36 pm 
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cwald wrote:
lostindc wrote:

Dehlin needs to just shut the hell up. He makes every issue about him, hence why the messenger continues to receive attention. His ego is insane.



True. But maybe not this time...Dehlin did not make this about himself until S. Gordon made it about John Dehlin, calling him out by name. Try to be fair about it. If Gordon had not called out Dehlin by name I think your argument would be stronger.

These guys have to know this is going to blow up in their face. The church is their own worst enemy.

Carry on.


Maybe. Maybe not. How will we know if we can't trust John's version of things? Which came first?

John attacked me for a long time taking public side swipes that I knew were happening and others might not have picked up on. (Although plenty of people did.) He was doing it to intimidate me into staying silent. Eventually I got the courage to stand up to him publicly. As soon as I did, John played victim because I dared say something (oh how I was hurting him!) and used that victimhood to turn people against me.

How will we know he didn't do the same thing to Gordon? Maybe there was a long-standing interaction that justifiably provoked Gordon's action.

Anyway..... I am glad I finally grew strong enough to stand up to him. I'm doing a lot better now because of it. It was a good thing for me to speak.

EDIT: lol.... I just realized this is all new garbage. I didn't watch the Gordon video before this morning (Wednesday the 13th). Gordon is just acting like a Mormon. He didn't attack John in any way John shouldn't expect to be attacked. Just a big lol at the whole thing. Another 'much ado about nothing.' Don't be fooled cwald. And if you're trying to troll me, just don't. I'm tired.

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Last edited by Rosebud on Wed Jul 13, 2016 5:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:42 pm 
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Rosebud wrote:
cwald wrote:
At the time of the Gordon hit piece, John absolutely claimed to believe in a god...probably even the Mormon God.


Publicly, not privately.


I know of no one who would say this, besides yourself. Is there anyone who has documentation, or even personal conversation with John, (besides Rosebud) who claims John Dehlin told them he did not believe in god prior to the 2011 hit piece? Even in the recent Infant on Thrones podcast he was very hesitant to claim atheism, even after Randy press him on it. He finally admitted that he may be a "hopeful agnostic" or a "reluctant atheist" at best.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:48 pm 
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Rosebud wrote:

Maybe. Maybe not. How will we know if we can't trust John's version of things? Which came first? ...


Well. Yeah. But I think you are well aware that I trust John's "version of the story" over yours simply because you won't really tell us what your story is. We ask and ask, but you talk in code and puzzles and cryptic and never just say it like it is...in plain simple language so we know what it is you are upset with John about. I don't mean to be rude, but we have had these conversations already and to be honest I'm not really interested in having them again on this thread.

We have had epic threads on this subject and to my knowledge you have never answered the question of "why you hate Dehlin so much" and What did Dehlin do that upset you so much." If I have missed a recent thread where you clearly answer these questions in a concise manner, please post a link. Thanks.

And I sure as hell trust John's version of this story over Gordon's.

Just my opinion.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:53 pm 
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I agree about them having to know it would blow up in their faces, fwiw. I knew that, definitely. He had me very effectively intimidated for a long time.

Keep in mind, too, that it wasn't as if I hadn't tried several times to find a good way to solve the problem that would have been safe for John. I had. I gave him plenty of chances and gave him months to calm down in hopes he would become more rational. I wasn't originally a threat to him. I didn't want to be. What it eventually came down to, though, was that he had his agenda -- hurting the church and becoming like a the September Six and he was willing to do anything he needed to do to achieve that. To be frank, I think he would have liked it if I had died. That would have really taken care of the problem of me for him.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:53 pm 
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Rosebud wrote:

How will we know he didn't do the same thing to Gordon? Maybe there was a long-standing interaction that justifiably provoked Gordon's action.


I guess it's possible, but I'm skeptical.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:54 pm 
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cwald wrote:
Rosebud wrote:

Maybe. Maybe not. How will we know if we can't trust John's version of things? Which came first? ...


Well. Yeah. But I think you are well aware that I trust John's "version of the story" over yours simply because you won't really tell us what your story is. We ask and ask, but you talk in code and puzzles and cryptic and never just say it like it is...in plain simple language so we know what it is you are upset with John about. I don't mean to be rude, but we have had these conversations already and to be honest I'm not really interested in having them again on this thread.

We have had epic threads on this subject and to my knowledge you have never answered the question of "why you hate Dehlin so much" and What did Dehlin do that upset you so much." If I have missed a recent thread where you clearly answer these questions in a concise manner, please post a link. Thanks.

And I sure as hell trust John's version of this story over Gordon's.

Just my opinion.


Cwald, take the time to read my posts. The story is in this board. Go look for it yourself.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:55 pm 
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Rosebud wrote:
I agree about them having to know it would blow up in their faces, fwiw. I knew that, definitely. He had me very effectively intimidated for a long time.

Keep in mind, too, that it wasn't as if I hadn't tried several times to find a good way to solve the problem that would have been safe for John. I had. I gave him plenty of chances and gave him months to calm down in hopes he would become more rational. I wasn't originally a threat to him. I didn't want to be. What it eventually came down to, though, was that he had his agenda -- hurting the church and becoming like a the September Six and he was willing to do anything he needed to do to achieve that. To be frank, I think he would have liked it if I had died. That would have really taken care of the problem of me for him.


Do you have a recent link Rosebud with this story in more detail since our last blowup with Lostindc and ME etc? I don't want to derail this thread.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 6:57 pm 
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It's not like Scott Gordon doesn't has a very public history of being caught in lie after lie and distortion after distortion.

He's a real choad:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EReUoXIesMI

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:09 pm 
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cwald wrote:
Rosebud wrote:
I agree about them having to know it would blow up in their faces, fwiw. I knew that, definitely. He had me very effectively intimidated for a long time.

Keep in mind, too, that it wasn't as if I hadn't tried several times to find a good way to solve the problem that would have been safe for John. I had. I gave him plenty of chances and gave him months to calm down in hopes he would become more rational. I wasn't originally a threat to him. I didn't want to be. What it eventually came down to, though, was that he had his agenda -- hurting the church and becoming like a the September Six and he was willing to do anything he needed to do to achieve that. To be frank, I think he would have liked it if I had died. That would have really taken care of the problem of me for him.


Do you have a recent link Rosebud with this story in more detail since our last blowup with Lostindc and ME etc? I don't want to derail this thread.


No. If I wanted to publish a long summary of what happened over time to spell it out for everyone, I wouldn't publish it on this board. I'd do something better with it. But I don't want to do that. It's not all about me and I have better things to do with my life than try to put together a credible attack on Dehlin. Then what? I just don't aspire to that. Plus, how does my story help Mormonism?

Anybody who wants to try to piece it together has the information they need. As I've stated on this board, I've filed other documents to be found by future historians (they're sealed from the public for now). That's kept me safer. Dehlin has been nicer since. Maybe someday I'll answer more questions. For now, I'm just making dated posts as I go. This is fairly benign considering. Plus, it allows me to live the rest of my life. I never wanted my public life to become about "Dehlin." Would you if you were me? I have other things to do.

Night.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:14 pm 
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Rosebud wrote:

No. If I wanted to publish a long summary of what happened over time to spell it out for everyone, I wouldn't publish it on this board..... I have better things to do with my life than try to put together a credible attack on Dehlin. ... Maybe someday I'll answer more questions. I never wanted my public life to become about "Dehlin.

Night.


Okay. Fair enough.

Goodnight, Peace.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:43 pm 
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What is the MAD board saying about all of this?

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 7:49 pm 
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Jesse Pinkman wrote:
What is the MAD board saying about all of this?


Crickets.

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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 8:49 pm 
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Maksutov wrote:
http://www.mormonstories.org/scott-gordon-fairmormon-smear/

Dear Scott Gordon (President of FAIRMormon),
Since you chose to publicly smear/malign me in a disingenuous way during your recent trip to Europe on multiple occasions (as has been reported to me by multiple sources — see video link below), I would like to ask you to do five things as a courtesy to me, and as a way to demonstrate your credibility to your followers....

JSjr always had a boogeyman, two, three, or...ending with Govenor Boggs and William Law. It's very Mormony of Gordon to need to abuse Dehlin or someone else in this way.


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 Post subject: Re: Dehlin blasts Gordon for "Smear"
PostPosted: Tue Jul 12, 2016 9:34 pm 
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John Dehlin wrote:

Quote:
These types of tactics are beneath you, Scott Gordon.

Heh, clearly he knows Scott Gordon about as well as Scott Gordon knows him.

Remember when the RfM community was planning on making a "Support Grant Palmer" website prior to his disciplinary council, but Scott hurried and bought up all the suggested URLs so they couldn't do it?

[MODERATOR NOTE: That was actually Allen Wyatt, not Scott Gordon. I apologize for the error. Please do not allow this post to tarnish your impression of Scott Gordon.]

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