His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

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_Bazooka
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _Bazooka »

Should a Church leader, in this case a Stake President, be allowed to excommunicate an individual for apostasy without being specific about what the individual has done that constitutes apostasy? I think I'd be tempted to write the SP in question an open, published letter requesting the specific evidence that has been used in reaching the decision.
That said, with the Book of Mormon, we are not dealing with a civilization with no written record. What we are dealing with is a written record with no civilization. (Runtu, Feb 2015)
_BartBurk
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _BartBurk »

Bazooka wrote:Should a Church leader, in this case a Stake President, be allowed to excommunicate an individual for apostasy without being specific about what the individual has done that constitutes apostasy? I think I'd be tempted to write the SP in question an open, published letter requesting the specific evidence that has been used in reaching the decision.


Based on what I've seen, Stake Presidents are almost all-powerful when it comes to this stuff. There aren't any rules they are bound to follow, and SLC doesn't seem to exercise very much control in favor of the common member against the Stake President. They take care of their own.
_malkie
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _malkie »

I wonder what would happen if someone (or someones) who is at the point where they don't care whether they were called to a church court were to (with permission, of course) reproduce Adrian Larsen's posts.

Or what else would that person need to do to provoke a court, with Larsen's blog posts as background.

Anyone here willing to test the case?
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_Fence Sitter
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _Fence Sitter »

Bazooka wrote:Should a Church leader, in this case a Stake President, be allowed to excommunicate an individual for apostasy without being specific about what the individual has done that constitutes apostasy? I think I'd be tempted to write the SP in question an open, published letter requesting the specific evidence that has been used in reaching the decision.

There is only one course of action acceptable in court cases where one is charged with apostasy. The very act of accusing someone of apostasy means that person is already convicted. To call it a trail is painting lipstick on the pig. It isn't a trail, it is a sentencing hearing, and the only options available to the convicted defendant are to agree to retract what has been said and to agree to cease saying it. Any attempt to defend what has been said or ask for a explanation of why it is wrong is another act of apostasy.

Frankly these apostasy excommunications remind me of the witch scene from the Monty Python's Holy Grail.
"Any over-ritualized religion since the dawn of time can make its priests say yes, we know, it is rotten, and hard luck, but just do as we say, keep at the ritual, stick it out, give us your money and you'll end up with the angels in heaven for evermore."
_BartBurk
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _BartBurk »

I'm glad the Mormon Church isn't a cult. Think how bad it would be if it were!
_Tator
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _Tator »

I'm not so sure the SP wasn't/isn't working directly under the direction of SLC. This may be why the wife and kids got "shot" too.
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_ludwigm
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Re: His blog, but they ex'd both husband and wife?

Post by _ludwigm »

I don't remember any handling of kids.

Anyway ... it would be Bible based: "for I the LORD thy God am a jealous God, visiting the iniquity of the fathers upon the children unto the third and fourth generation of them"
- Whenever a poet or preacher, chief or wizard spouts gibberish, the human race spends centuries deciphering the message. - Umberto Eco
- To assert that the earth revolves around the sun is as erroneous as to claim that Jesus was not born of a virgin. - Cardinal Bellarmine at the trial of Galilei
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