Book of Abraham Scroll Length

Chap · **Joined:** Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:23 am **Posts:** 5551

Kishkumen wrote:

Chap wrote:

(my bold emphasis added)

The wonderful point about Facsimile 3 is that we indubitably have in front of us a readable version of an Egyptian document Joseph Smith actually translated.

And every damn' thing he said was wrong (Like Smith's 'Pharaoh' was Isis, and so on). Not much room for catalyst theory there.

I can quite understand why Paul goes on and on 'hammering in the nail' on this one.

As we can see on this and other threads, one can always pretend there is wiggle room even after the game over.

I agree with the general point about wiggle room, .... but ....

I realize you have the gratitude of a student towards a stimulating teacher for Hugh Nibley, and I do not cite him here to annoy you.

But I think it is significant that when some one as clever and learned as Nibley tried to find wiggle room in relation to Facsimile 3, the best he could do was the shimmering web of rhetoric and what the French call 'drowning the fish' in "All the Court's a Stage: Facsimile 3, a Royal Mumming". .

Nibley did the best that could be done. But it is a pretty hopeless cause.

Buffalo · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 2:48 pm

jskains wrote:

You know what, Chris. I was building up a response, but I really don't think you'd listen. I post a lot of things, and the pathetic children of this board usually act just like Kevin Graham here. It's cheaper to just call someone an idiot or insult or character assassinate than to have a mature dialogue. It's easier to just say "Your characterization of ABC is wrong" and run off to a new topic. It's easier to just say someone is ignorant than to take the time to understand their view.

I am designing a competitive board to both here and MD. One that not only locks down namecalling, but also doesn't lock down free flow of ideas.

I know this place doesn't get the difference. Openness to ideas but stopping the namecalling and insults are both compatible goals.

Too bad Shades and his pals here are too blinded by hate to see it.

JMS

You just know that Skains had a cogent response backed up with substantive evidence. But now we don't get the privilege of reading it! :lol:

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

CaliforniaKid wrote:

jskains wrote:

It's easier to just say "Your characterization of ABC is wrong" and run off to a new topic.

My reasons for thinking your characterization is inaccurate are given in points 2 and 3. I'm sorry you feel I won't listen to you. I don't think you're an idiot, Josh, and I hope I never give you the impression that I do.

No one listens here. It's more about mockery and insult. And every time I do try to have a dialogue, people act like clowns around here. This is the trailer park. And it's truly a sad situation.

JMS

Chap · **Joined:** Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:23 am **Posts:** 5551

Buffalo wrote:

jskains wrote:

You know what, Chris. I was building up a response, but I really don't think you'd listen. I post a lot of things, and the pathetic children of this board usually act just like Kevin Graham here. It's cheaper to just call someone an idiot or insult or character assassinate than to have a mature dialogue. It's easier to just say "Your characterization of ABC is wrong" and run off to a new topic. It's easier to just say someone is ignorant than to take the time to understand their view.

I am designing a competitive board to both here and MD. One that not only locks down namecalling, but also doesn't lock down free flow of ideas.

I know this place doesn't get the difference. Openness to ideas but stopping the namecalling and insults are both compatible goals.

Too bad Shades and his pals here are too blinded by hate to see it.

JMS

You just know that Skains had a cogent response backed up with substantive evidence. But now we don't get the privilege of reading it! :lol:

Hearing a sustained exposition of argument and evidence from jskains seems a bit like getting Tobin's favorite deity to say something to us. Some of us will have to wait all the way to the day of judgement.

But then we'll be sorry. Real sorry. Yeah.

Sophocles · **Joined:** Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:39 pm **Posts:** 274

jskains wrote:

I am designing a competitive board to both here and MD. One that not only locks down namecalling, but also doesn't lock down free flow of ideas.

You mean this one?

Might want to work on weeding out the spambots.

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Sophocles wrote:

jskains wrote:

I am designing a competitive board to both here and MD. One that not only locks down namecalling, but also doesn't lock down free flow of ideas.

You mean this one?

Might want to work on weeding out the spambots.

And? If you notice it is already cleared out.

Was this some dramatic reveal or something?

JMS

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Chap wrote:

Hearing a sustained exposition of argument and evidence from jskains seems a bit like getting Tobin's favorite deity to say something to us. Some of us will have to wait all the way to the day of judgement.

But then we'll be sorry. Real sorry. Yeah.

This is why discussions here are impossible. There is zero maturity, respect, or integrity. The reason I don't post is because there is no integrity here. Every time I try to say something, it is drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric, and I struggle to get heard above the noise.

It's usually compounded by Scratch running off like a little greedy child, looking for some snippet of the past he can drag up to further insult me.

JMS

Buffalo · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 3:05 pm

jskains wrote:

Chap wrote:

Hearing a sustained exposition of argument and evidence from jskains seems a bit like getting Tobin's favorite deity to say something to us. Some of us will have to wait all the way to the day of judgement.

But then we'll be sorry. Real sorry. Yeah.

This is why discussions here are impossible. There is zero maturity, respect, or integrity. The reason I don't post is because there is no integrity here. Every time I try to say something, it is drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric, and I struggle to get heard above the noise.

It's usually compounded by Scratch running off like a little greedy child, looking for some snippet of the past he can drag up to further insult me.

JMS

You realize that if you don't censor certain sensitive topics, you won't get any Mormon participants, right?

Chap · **Joined:** Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:23 am **Posts:** 5551

If jskains is sincere about having a substantive argument to make, he can try it in Celestial. I promise not to come up there and poke fun at him if he does.

But anyone who can respond to the gentle, peaceloving and scholarly Chris Smith the way he did a few posts ago is probably not to be taken seriously.

Darth J · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 3:08 pm

jskains wrote:

people act like clowns around here. This is the trailer park.

JMS

jskains wrote:

Can you come up with something other than childish namecalling and insults?

JMS

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Chap wrote:

If jskains is sincere about having a substantive argument to make, he can try it in Celestial. I promise not to come up there and poke fun at him if he does.

But anyone who can respond to the gentle, peaceloving and scholarly Chris Smith the way he did a few posts ago is probably not to be taken seriously.

Boy is that a logical fallacy.

JMS

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Darth J wrote:

jskains wrote:

people act like clowns around here. This is the trailer park.

JMS

jskains wrote:

Can you come up with something other than childish namecalling and insults?

JMS

I am sure you are unable to tell the difference.

JMS

Dr. Shades · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 3:18 pm

jskains wrote:

This is why discussions here are impossible. There is zero maturity, respect, or integrity.

May I suggest The Celestial Forum? It'll save you the trouble of creating your own board.

Quote:

The reason I don't post is because there is no integrity here.

You don't post?

Quote:

Every time I try to say something, it is drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric, and I struggle to get heard above the noise.

You aren't heard?

DarkHelmet · **Joined:** Tue Mar 03, 2009 5:38 pm **Posts:** 2501

jskains wrote:

Every time I try to say something, it is drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric, and I struggle to get heard above the noise.

JMS

The Flat Earthers have the same problem.

Kishkumen · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 3:19 pm

jskains wrote:

I am sure you are unable to tell the difference.

JMS

Between comparing people with clowns and insulting them?

Buffalo · **Posted:** Tue May 15, 2012 3:20 pm

jskains wrote:

I am sure you are unable to tell the difference.

JMS

You're a clown.

Sophocles · **Joined:** Wed Dec 19, 2007 10:39 pm **Posts:** 274

jskains wrote:

Sophocles wrote:

You mean this one?

Might want to work on weeding out the spambots.

And? If you notice it is already cleared out.

Was this some dramatic reveal or something?

No, I was just surprised that you already had several members signed up.

Then I noticed they are all spambots.

By the way, Josh, I've tried to engage you in a substantive way several times over on Celestial, and you don't appear to be interested. Chris Smith has made a good faith effort to interact with you here, but you appear to be unwilling or unable to respond in kind.

You are correct that a lot of your contributions do tend to invite some dismissive remarks along with abrupt rebuttals. I can totally understand how it would feel like every time you try to say something, you're drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric.

At the same time, you seem to eagerly respond to posts that treat you like a petulant child, and ignore posts that treat you like an intelligent adult. So what do you expect?

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Buffalo wrote:

jskains wrote:

I am sure you are unable to tell the difference.

JMS

You're a clown.

Your mother.

JMS

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Dr. Shades wrote:

jskains wrote:

This is why discussions here are impossible. There is zero maturity, respect, or integrity.

May I suggest The Celestial Forum? It'll save you the trouble of creating your own board.

Quote:

The reason I don't post is because there is no integrity here.

You don't post?

Quote:

Every time I try to say something, it is drowned out by attacks, mockery, and rhetoric, and I struggle to get heard above the noise.

You aren't heard?

Sorry Shades, but the problem too is your moderation. You support people threatening other's families, but then ban people over revealing the threat. I'd rather compete and get intelligent dialogue void of your board's ugliness.

JMS

jskains · **Joined:** Fri Dec 14, 2007 10:06 am **Posts:** 1749

Sophocles wrote:

I will say that a lot of your contributions are neither well thought out nor artfully expressed.

See? Exactly the poor attitude I would expect.

JMS

Chap · **Joined:** Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:23 am **Posts:** 5551

jskains wrote:

Chap wrote:

If jskains is sincere about having a substantive argument to make, he can try it in Celestial. I promise not to come up there and poke fun at him if he does.

But anyone who can respond to the gentle, peaceloving and scholarly Chris Smith the way he did a few posts ago is probably not to be taken seriously.

Boy is that a logical fallacy.

JMS

Since you ask, no it isn't.

This is an example of a logical fallacy:

All cows are mammals.
Human beings are mammals.
Therefore all human beings are cows.

'Logical fallacy' is not just a classy way of referring to a statement you disagree with. It refers to a structural flaw in an argument. Can you show a structural flaw in an argument in my post?

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