It is currently Thu Dec 18, 2014 3:20 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 771 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 ... 37  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:34 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 9:06 am
Posts: 9726
Location: Kershaw, SC
Quote:
So, does this also mean that Egyptologists are dependent on Joseph Smith's Explanations of Facsimile No. 3 in order to understand the original intentions given by the Egyptian scribe who produced the work?


Why the continual, obsessive fixation on fascimile 3 Paul? What was in the large corpus of textual material that existed in the 19th century, but is not now extant? What was in that material Paul?

Quote:
I would like to say that Joseph Smith didn't know what he was talking about. He was an ignorant fool when it came to Egyptology.
Quote:


Sure he was. But then, he never claimed otherwise, and there is no evidence the text of the BofA was translated from any presently existing documents, or their remains.

Quote:
Do you disagree with that, Droopy? If so, please provide evidence to show otherwise.

Otherwise, shut the hell up.




Then came the Paully Wally man, wailing songs of woe...

_________________
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:39 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 9:06 am
Posts: 9726
Location: Kershaw, SC
Quote:
Apparently Will thinks that a dependency on a pre-existing Book of Abraham text somehow passes for explaining "the meaning and purpose of the KEP." It all comes down to that: and yet isn't that what Nibley also proposed?


Even if Will's knowledge was a fraction of what it actually is in this area, that would still be a substantial improvement over the abyssal ignorance, tendentiousness and groupthink that passes for serious discourse about the issue among most in this forum, would it not?

_________________
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:43 pm 
Quote:
Why the continual, obsessive fixation on fascimile 3 Paul? What was in the large corpus of textual material that existed in the 19th century, but is not now extant? What was in that material Paul?


Did you say something, Droopy? Sorry, but my Egyptological skills are not helping me understand you. Are you trying to fake me out? You should know better than that.

Quote:
Sure he was. But then, he never claimed otherwise, and there is no evidence the text of the BofA was translated from any presently existing documents, or their remains.


And the name of the king in Facsimile No 3 is ______________.

Quote:
Then came the Paully Wally man, wailing songs of woe...


I can deal with this. I'm satisfied knowing that your testimony is being destroyed. It give me joy.

Paul O


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:48 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 9:06 am
Posts: 9726
Location: Kershaw, SC
Quote:
Your annoyingly sesquipedalian and pleonastic prose isn't helping you out here, Droopy,


Sorry that your vocabulary and prose skills are still in the 7th to 8th grade area of general competence Scratch.

Good grief. Paul needs Egyptology textbooks with centerfolds and you need a creative writing class at the local community college.

Quote:
nor is your appallingly dumb claim about "large quantities of textual material."


Care to elucidate on that?

Quote:
That pretty much shows right up front that you don't know what the KEP are
.

At one time, we had no idea what the KEP were. Will has given us some idea of what they probably were, or something very close to that. We now at least have a working theoretical framework. That framework, however, does not include the fanciful hope of a KEP dependent BofA.

_________________
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:50 pm 
Droopy,

And the name of the king in Facsimile No 3 is ______________.

Paul O


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:52 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 9:06 am
Posts: 9726
Location: Kershaw, SC
Quote:
And the name of the king in Facsimile No 3 is


Ish Kabibble

Quote:
I can deal with this. I'm satisfied knowing that your testimony is destroyed. being It give me joy.


You are, Paul, a mental masturbatory legend in your own mind.

_________________
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell


Last edited by Droopy on Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:53 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:52 pm 
Seedy Academician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:00 pm
Posts: 13866
Location: The Brutus Memorial Rectory at Cassius University
Droopy wrote:
Will has given us some idea of what they probably were, or something very close to that.


Well, at least you have brains enough not to traffic in the degree of hyperbole that Will does concerning all of his "conclusive findings."

_________________
The Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies
The Definitive Electronic Jaredite Bibliography

"I don't profess to be such a Prophet as were Joseph Smith and Daniel; but I am a Yankee guesser." ~Brigham Young


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 6:59 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 9:06 am
Posts: 9726
Location: Kershaw, SC
Kishkumen wrote:
Droopy wrote:
Will has given us some idea of what they probably were, or something very close to that.


Well, at least you have brains not to traffic in the degree of hyperbole that Will does concerning all of his "conclusive findings."


No need to put words in my mouth. I think Will's findings are conclusive in that the BofA could not possibly have been dependent upon the KEP. Indeed, the causal relation between them is the obverse of this.

This being said, Will's views of the origin and meaning of the KEP comprise, as I'm sure Will would tell you, a theory, in need of refinement, criticism, further data, and further research. Whatever the KEP's real purpose ultimately turns out to have been, I do think that, yes, the dependence of the KEP upon an already existing BofA has been demonstrated with rigorous cogency.

_________________
Nothing is going to startle us more when we pass through the veil to the other side than to realize how well we know our Father [in Heaven] and how familiar his face is to us

- President Ezra Taft Benson


I am so old that I can remember when most of the people promoting race hate were white.

- Thomas Sowell


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 7:09 pm 
Seedy Academician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:00 pm
Posts: 13866
Location: The Brutus Memorial Rectory at Cassius University
Droopy wrote:
No need to put words in my mouth.


Gee thanks, because I didn't.

Droopy wrote:
I think Will's findings are conclusive that the BofA could not possibly have been dependent upon the KEP. Indeed, the causal relation between them is the obverse of this.


A handful of your spit is probably worth more than your personal opinion about what is and is not conclusive about Will's work--something that is changing on a minute to minute basis, in any case. (Causing Dr. Hauglid to come out of lurk mode and caution Will about the risks of throwing around the word "conclusively.")

Droopy wrote:
Whatever its real purpose ultimately turns out to be, I do think, yes, that the dependence of the KEP upon an already existing BofA has been demonstrated with rigorous cogency.


In other words, he blew the significance of his presentation out of all reasonable proportions, selling it as though it were the best thing since the discovery of the Book of Mormon plates. Now, he has you thinking, a person whose understanding of academia is severely limited (to put it incredibly politely and mildly), that he could have possibly demonstrated such a thing with "rigorous cogency" (empty Will and Droopy New Speak) without having even started the formal discussion.

Droopy, the simple fact is that you are ignorant about academics. And this has nothing to do with my level of agreement with those who disagree with Will. What it has to do with is my well-earned understanding of how academia works--something that neither you nor Will has much of a clue about, but that people like Dr. Hauglid and some of us probably do know something about. You would be well advised to listen to the people who actually work as academics, as opposed to the mindless self-promotions of William Schryver... even though it will be difficult given the level of knee-jerk disdain both of you have for academia.

_________________
The Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies
The Definitive Electronic Jaredite Bibliography

"I don't profess to be such a Prophet as were Joseph Smith and Daniel; but I am a Yankee guesser." ~Brigham Young


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 7:48 pm 
Droopy wrote:
Ish Kabibble


Nice try, Droopy. I see Joe Smith has trained you well after the manner of practicing deceit -- a typical Mormon trick. You're mistaken, Droopy. Your answer is absolutely incorrect. The words "Ish Kabbibble" are not found in the Egyptian writing of Facsimile No. 3.

Droopy wrote:
You are, Paul, a mental masturbatory legend in your own mind


There may be some truth to that, Droopy. But your answer above still remains incorrect. You and your founding prophet are liars. I say that in the name of Jesus Christ, amen.

Paul O


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Sun Oct 10, 2010 9:15 pm 
\m/ \m/
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:52 am
Posts: 12479
Location: at the point
Droopy wrote:
I think Will's findings are conclusive in that the BofA could not possibly have been dependent upon the KEP. Indeed, the causal relation between them is the obverse of this.


Droopy, Will points to the fact that there is an overlap of about 69 pronouns used in both the Book of Abraham and the EA&G. That demonstrates that there is a high likelihood of dependence of one on the other, or each on the other. It does not show what direction of that dependence, nor that there was not bi-directional dependence going on in the simultaneous creation of the two documents.

Will also points out that the Book of Abraham has more "story" to it than the EA&G. Really? Of course the finished product would. That points up that the EA&G were mere "work papers" for Joseph Smith and scribes in eventually producing the more expansive Book of Abraham. It does not necessarily follow from that observation, as Will claims it does, that the EA&G must have derived from the more expansive Book of Abraham.

(I wonder how Will's theory answers for the progression of degrees in the GAEL, getting ever more expansive as they progress on the pages. After all, it is conclusive that if looking at two writings and one is more expansive than the other, the more expansive one must have been prepared first and the lesser ones just derived from it. So, his theory would posit that the 5th degrees were all written first, then the lesser degrees taken from the 5th degree. That makes sense--not. Look at the progression. Smith showed that he was making large leaps of expansion, not derivations. So why not the leap from the 5th expansion to the finished text of Book of Abraham?)

I stand all amazed at how this translates into conclusive.

_________________
Chap Mormon apologetics only works for people who are so heavily invested in the CoJCoLDS that they have to swallow anything to keep their testimony intact.

Bill Maher Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking.

Mark Twain defined faith as believing what you know ain’t true.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 3:28 am 
God
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:26 pm
Posts: 13469
Droopy wrote:
Whatever the KEP's real purpose ultimately turns out to have been


Wade actually once tried to identify the "meaning and purpose" of the KEP by asserting it was meant to be a cipher. Will responded as I quoted above: no, that's secondary and pretty irrelevant. I don't think any Willite has even attempted to identify "the meaning and purpose of the KEP" since then.

And yet Will thinks Brent cowardly retreated from the debate due to not wanting to touch Will's Magnificent Meaning and Purpose of the KEP. Perhaps Brent is just like the Willites, and seemingly every person who has listened to the presentation: they can't figure out what Will thinks The Meaning and Purpose of the KEP really is.

_________________
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 5:52 am 
Seedy Academician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:00 pm
Posts: 13866
Location: The Brutus Memorial Rectory at Cassius University
beastie wrote:
Perhaps Brent is just like the Willites, and seemingly every person who has listened to the presentation: they can't figure out what Will thinks The Meaning and Purpose of the KEP really is.


Future book sales?

_________________
The Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies
The Definitive Electronic Jaredite Bibliography

"I don't profess to be such a Prophet as were Joseph Smith and Daniel; but I am a Yankee guesser." ~Brigham Young


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:27 pm 
God
User avatar

Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 7:26 pm
Posts: 13469
Kishkumen wrote:
beastie wrote:
Perhaps Brent is just like the Willites, and seemingly every person who has listened to the presentation: they can't figure out what Will thinks The Meaning and Purpose of the KEP really is.


Future book sales?


Yes, well, perhaps he'll have figured out his theory by then.

BTW, Will, I'd greatly appreciate a link to a post wherein one of your followers clearly and accurately identifies the "meaning and purpose" of the KEP.

_________________
We hate to seem like we don’t trust every nut with a story, but there’s evidence we can point to, and dance while shouting taunting phrases.

Penn & Teller

http://www.mormonmesoamerica.com


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:47 pm 
\m/ \m/
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jul 23, 2010 7:52 am
Posts: 12479
Location: at the point
beastie wrote:
Perhaps Brent is just like the Willites, and seemingly every person who has listened to the presentation: they can't figure out what Will thinks The Meaning and Purpose of the KEP really is.
Kishkumen wrote:
Future book sales?
beastie wrote:
Yes, well, perhaps he'll have figured out his theory by then.

BTW, Will, I'd greatly appreciate a link to a post wherein one of your followers clearly and accurately identifies the "meaning and purpose" of the KEP.


BTW, Will, do you have available a text of your FAIR presentation that you'd make available? Not just the slides, but what you said as part of your presentation.

_________________
Chap Mormon apologetics only works for people who are so heavily invested in the CoJCoLDS that they have to swallow anything to keep their testimony intact.

Bill Maher Faith means making a virtue out of not thinking.

Mark Twain defined faith as believing what you know ain’t true.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 4:21 pm 
Quote:
BTW, Will, do you have available a text of your FAIR presentation that you'd make available? Not just the slides, but what you said as part of your presentation.


You must admit that William's presentation would be a blast under a large tent where peanuts, snow cones, and cotton candy are sold. Hot dogs too.

I think everyone would pay at least $2 to be there. The experience in itself would make it worth it regardless of the content.

Paul O


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:19 pm 
Kishkumen wrote:
A handful of your spit is probably worth more than your personal opinion about what is and is not conclusive about Will's work--something that is changing on a minute to minute basis, in any case. (Causing Dr. Hauglid to come out of lurk mode and caution Will about the risks of throwing around the word "conclusively.")


And here it is again, Kishkumen. An example of baseless anti-Mormonism. There might still be hope for you, however, if you change your ways.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:20 pm 
So, is this thing happening or what? I mean, seriously.


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:47 pm 
Seedy Academician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:00 pm
Posts: 13866
Location: The Brutus Memorial Rectory at Cassius University
Simon Belmont wrote:
Kishkumen wrote:
A handful of your spit is probably worth more than your personal opinion about what is and is not conclusive about Will's work--something that is changing on a minute to minute basis, in any case. (Causing Dr. Hauglid to come out of lurk mode and caution Will about the risks of throwing around the word "conclusively.")


And here it is again, Kishkumen. An example of baseless anti-Mormonism. There might still be hope for you, however, if you change your ways.


Simon, can you defend these baseless charges? Or have you now stooped to simply making things up?

_________________
The Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies
The Definitive Electronic Jaredite Bibliography

"I don't profess to be such a Prophet as were Joseph Smith and Daniel; but I am a Yankee guesser." ~Brigham Young


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 5:49 pm 
Kishkumen wrote:

Simon, can you defend these baseless charges? Or have you now stooped to simply making things up?


Which charges?


Top
  
 
 Post subject: Re: Metcalfe Schryver Debate Set to Go
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 6:06 pm 
Seedy Academician
User avatar

Joined: Sat Dec 13, 2008 3:00 pm
Posts: 13866
Location: The Brutus Memorial Rectory at Cassius University
Simon Belmont wrote:
Which charges?


You deceitfully mischaracterized my criticisms of Mopologetics as anti-Mormonism.

Can you defend your lie?

_________________
The Electronic Journal of Jaredite Studies
The Definitive Electronic Jaredite Bibliography

"I don't profess to be such a Prophet as were Joseph Smith and Daniel; but I am a Yankee guesser." ~Brigham Young


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 771 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30 ... 37  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Arrakis, Doctor Steuss, DrW, Google [Bot], Gray Ghost, Uther, Yahoo [Bot], Zadok, Zub Zool oan and 27 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Jump to:  
Revival Theme By Brandon Designs By B.Design-Studio © 2007-2008 Brandon
Revival Theme Based off SubLite By Echo © 2007-2008 Echo
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group