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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:11 pm 
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I would also say that a good part of the Old Testament is a bunch of made up stuff. It's utter nonsense and downright evil, i.e., Killing babies because the bloody God of Moses commands it? The Moses we read about in the Bible was a horrible man. The God as portrayed in the OT is an evil image of everything that is wrong in this world.


Actually, it's a tough love response to everything that's wrong ion the world and a testimony that God values the condition of your spirit more than He does your mortal life.

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The BofA is a lie. A lie makes nothing true and neither is truth established in a lie. Give it up BC.


I've yet to be presented with a valid reason to give it up, much less a convincing argument that the Book of Abraham is false.

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:51 pm 
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Actually, it's a tough love response to everything that's wrong ion the world and a testimony that God values the condition of your spirit more than He does your mortal life.


Oh I see, the Jewish God sending his axeman to slay babies? That's tough love! Thank God this is not the real God that rules the heavens. I know, based on what I've read from you in the past, BC, that you don't really believe all those stories as they are presented in Jewish tradition, handed down from ages of lore.

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I've yet to be presented with a valid reason to give it up, much less a convincing argument that the Book of Abraham is false


You have been presented with valid reasons but are testimony driven and stubborn. You'll stick it out as long as you can stand it before you finally give it up. You know too much. Seen too much. Heard too much. It's only a matter of time for you BC, like William, you'll become an apostate and that's actually a good thing! It's not a dirty word. To become a Mormon apostate is to clean yourself of denial and be honest.

The fuzzy feelings of the holy ghost are not what you think. Can you see the ghost? No, it is only a feeling that you are trying to interpret. Actually, those fuzzy warm feelings are felt by everyone of all religions all the time. Mormons have taken a special claim to themselves as if they own warm fuzzy feelings as a special religion by the laying on of their priesthood hands. This is false. God gives warm fuzzy feelings to everyone without hands, without price, and without the BofA or BofM, or silly Bible stories.

You BC, will be an apostate.

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:56 pm 
midnight rambler

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Paul Osborne wrote:
Quote:
Actually, it's a tough love response to everything that's wrong ion the world and a testimony that God values the condition of your spirit more than He does your mortal life.


Oh I see, the Jewish God sending his axeman to slay babies? That's tough love! Thank God this is not the real God that rules the heavens. I know, based on what I've read from you in the past, BC, that you don't really believe all those stories as they are presented in Jewish tradition, handed down from ages of lore.

Quote:
I've yet to be presented with a valid reason to give it up, much less a convincing argument that the Book of Abraham is false


You have been presented with valid reasons but are testimony driven and stubborn. You'll stick it out as long as you can stand it before you finally give it up. You know too much. Seen too much. Heard too much. It's only a matter of time for you BC, like William, you'll become an apostate and that's actually a good thing! It's not a dirty word. To become a Mormon apostate is to clean yourself of denial and be honest.

The fuzzy feelings of the holy ghost are not what you think. Can you see the ghost? No, it is only a feeling that you are trying to interpret. Actually, those fuzzy warm feelings are felt by everyone of all religions all the time. Mormons have taken a special claim to themselves as if they own warm fuzzy feelings as a special religion by the laying on of their priesthood hands. This is false. God gives warm fuzzy feelings to everyone without hands, without price, and without the BofA or BofM, or silly Bible stories.

You BC, will be an apostate.

Paul O

The LDS warm fuzzies (i.e., burning bosoms) are kind of like hypnosis--the power of suggestion and the willingness, even desire, to be manipulated, to feel a part of something and taken care of. Much to bcspace's chagrin, it is in reality very akin to the desire for many in any society for society to take care of them. Get it?

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 2:59 pm 
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Oh I see, the Jewish God sending his axeman to slay babies? That's tough love!


Do you have a specific referenced concern?

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I know, based on what I've read from you in the past, BC, that you don't really believe all those stories as they are presented in Jewish tradition, handed down from ages of lore.


Then you bear false testimony.

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You have been presented with valid reasons


Not any that are not flawless or not based on speculation or some logical fallacy.

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You'll stick it out as long as you can stand it before you finally give it up. You know too much. Seen too much. Heard too much. It's only a matter of time for you BC, like William, you'll become an apostate and that's actually a good thing! It's not a dirty word. To become a Mormon apostate is to clean yourself of denial and be honest.


Keep hoping.

Quote:
The fuzzy feelings of the holy ghost are not what you think. Can you see the ghost? No, it is only a feeling that you are trying to interpret. Actually, those fuzzy warm feelings are felt by everyone of all religions all the time. Mormons have taken a special claim to themselves as if they own warm fuzzy feelings as a special religion by the laying on of their priesthood hands. This is false. God gives warm fuzzy feelings to everyone without hands, without price, and without the BofA or BofM, or silly Bible stories.


Actually,the Holy Ghost speaks to me ia pure logic. Any warm fuzzies I feel are the result of rational realization.

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You BC, will be an apostate.


I already am according to some yes. But those too I think will be disappointed as well.

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Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
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Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
A lesson on 'Faggotry' for Kevin Graham; a legitimately descriptive and even positive term used by homosexuals themselves.


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:02 pm 
midnight rambler

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bcspace wrote:
Actually,the Holy Ghost speaks to me ia pure logic. Any warm fuzzies I feel are the result of rational realization.
In any other context, that's called simply rationalization.

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:12 pm 
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In any other context, that's called simply rationalization.


A rationalization can have a perfectly logical and reasonable basis.

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Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
A lesson on 'Faggotry' for Kevin Graham; a legitimately descriptive and even positive term used by homosexuals themselves.


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:26 pm 
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Then you bear false testimony.


Nonetheless, I believe my testimony of you is true, infact, I know it. Whether it is truth established in fact or not is beside the point. I believe it. And you believe the BofA inspite of everything you've been shown to prove otherwise. You depend on your warm fuzzy feelings that you interpret to be a messages from God that automatically declares the BofA to be true because of warm feelings you've had while thinking about your religion. This is false dreaming, in my view. Been there, done that.

Warm fuzzy feelings people get all the time! On par with Mormon fuzzies!

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:34 pm 
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Not any that are not flawless or not based on speculation or some logical fallacy.


What's perfect in this life, BC? You've been shown enough and to continue in denial is outright foolishness. Look, flawed BofA apologetics far exceed flawed antiBofA presentations! The logical fallacy spewed by the critic pale in comparison to those presented by the faithful. Oh my God, surely you can see this to be so. The arguments from the apologists are hardly enough to convert anyone to believe the BofA. It is the warm fuzzy feelings had by a convert while thinking about Mormonism that offers any real chance of accepting the BofA. On the other hand, the critics can easily manage to keep the whole world (billions) away from the BofA because their arguments are sane.

Your testimony of the BofA hangs by a fuzzy feeling that you have misinterpreted to be a blank check from God stating that all of Mormonism is true. You've made a terrible mistake. But you can change that.

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:37 pm 
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Whether it is truth established in fact or not is beside the point. I believe it.


Yet established facts are what the other apostates on this board (including yourself iirc) claim to be missing in the Church. Yet here you are bearing your testimony that you KNOW these things are true. LOL!

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Satan's Plan Deconstructed.
Your Best Resource On Joseph Smith's Polygamy.
Conservatism is the Gospel of Christ and the Plan of Salvation in Action.
The Degeneracy Of Progressivism.
A lesson on 'Faggotry' for Kevin Graham; a legitimately descriptive and even positive term used by homosexuals themselves.


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:43 pm 
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Wish I was a political cartoonist. The vision of Joseph Smith with his face in a hat, and next to him BC with his head buried in the sand came clearly to mind.


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:46 pm 
This is your faith speaking. You don't really know. You think and believe and base your testimony on the interpretations of feelings you've had while thinking about the truthfulness of Mormonism. This is purely a religious experience on an individual level. There is a great deal of error experienced by those who think about God and get fuzzy feelings.

What is rational? Have you seen Jesus face to face? Have you spoken to the resurrected Jesus face to face and felt his hands and feet? I don't think so. You simply believe and base it all on faith. This is not rational, it is spiritual. And, you know not all spiritual things are true.

And yes, many good faithful Mormons would consider you apostate if they knew your thoughts. You are over the edge. You are not a chapel Mormon by any means. You will join us, I will keep hoping. BC the Internet Mormon!!

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 3:54 pm 
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Yet established facts are what the other apostates on this board (including yourself iirc) claim to be missing in the Church. Yet here you are bearing your testimony that you KNOW these things are true. LOL!


Laugh it up. Your testimony of the BofA is laughable to millions of sane thinking people all over the world. Billions of people could consider the facts and reject the BofA outright. You are in the minority. You depend soley on your warm fuzzy feelings about Mormonism and have been doing that for quite sometime. Actually, my guess is you haven't had those warm feelings in quite some time and are living on past glory. Am I correct, sir? You'll run out gas after the fun wears off.

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 4:10 pm 
midnight rambler

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bcspace wrote:
Quote:
In any other context, that's called simply rationalization.


A rationalization can have a perfectly logical and reasonable basis.
bcspace, since warm fuzzies=truth, you would love the truth of beer. About 2 of them, and your bosom will burn. And then, the more the merrier. Granted, your idol, Joseph Smith, preferred wine when wanting the brethren assembled in the Kirtland Temple to feel the power of the warm fuzzy, but beer simply tastes better than wine. 'See that light that just wisped through, gents, that was Jesus. Here, have another goblet of wine.'

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 6:57 pm 
Paul Osborne wrote:
Holy God, dblagent007, I can't believe the website is in the web archive!

http://web.archive.org/web/200710070924 ... le/id3.htm

I was a catalyst apologist and butted heads with my believing fellows over this issue.

Paul O

Paul!!! :)

It's good to see you!

I hope you had a good Easter.

Email me when you get a chance. I've been worried about you.


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 7:28 pm 
Thanks, Liz. I just sent you an email. I had a blast buying that new car last night and driving it off the dealer lot, dirty new red car with stickers on the windows -- no one to detail the car because of the holiday eve.

Hey, BC, come to think of it I think I've had more fuzzy warm feelings since leaving the church than when I was in it! So, take that one to the bishop's desk. Yep, those warm feelings of love and peace that wash over you from head to toe! Do you know what I mean? Those feelings, buddy. They are wonderful. Call it the holy ghooooost, call it the jimmy hendrix experience, you can call it Ray or you can call it Jay, or Coors beer for all I care, those feelings are awsome. They are what kept me glued to Mormonism because I believed it was those feelings that verified Mormonism. But lo, and behold, those same glorious feelings, even better and longer, are upon me after leaving Mormonism! Those wonderful feelings wash all over me knowing that I've left the cult. But with that said, I don't regret my life in the cult. It was a learning experience. My ancestors joined the church in 1831 and Mormonism runs in my blood, but I broke away, I'm free! Thank God. I'm free and I can do lots of sins and not feel guilty. That's the best part! Yeah! Porn!

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:14 pm 
God

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So are the scroll parts that LDSinc has now the same that Joseph told and showed the famous writer were written by Abraham, Moses and the gang? Is any of the scroll in LDSinc possession that old?

What LDSinc does have... do current scholars interpret it the same as Joseph Smith did in his explanation as contained in the Pearl of Great Price? Are Josephs and the current egyptologists interpretations close?

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:43 pm 
zzyzx wrote:
So are the scroll parts that LDSinc has now the same that Joseph told and showed the famous writer were written by Abraham, Moses and the gang? Is any of the scroll in LDSinc possession that old?

What LDSinc does have... do current scholars interpret it the same as Joseph Smith did in his explanation as contained in the Pearl of Great Price? Are Josephs and the current egyptologists interpretations close?


All of these questions should be answered by the President of the church, but we see that all of the Presidents are cowards. They haven't the guts to approach the flame of scrutiny and get burned doing it. Indeed, even President Monson, a nice guy he is, he is a coward. No need to go to the FARMER apologists that root in the mire of lies. They are not LDS Inc. The apologists are like clowns and disposable trinkets for the prophets, they are whores for the church.

Let the prophets step foward and answer the questions. Sue the prophets for answers because they are the biggest cowards of Mormonism. Those fools couldn't bring down fire out of heaven or part the sea. They deserve to be mocked! Awaay with them! They make big claims, "PROPHET, SEER, REVELATOR", and yet we see they have no real power. Someday, someone, will clean their clocks! Perhaps Nightlion will bring fire down upon them and destroy those liars.

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:50 pm 
the very elect
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CaliforniaKid wrote:
ttribe wrote:
I suggest that, in the world of academic publishing, this post could be construed very negatively (whether you end up being right about it or not). Just fair warning - there are such things as unwritten rules. Publicly maligning an author of an opposing viewpoint like this is generally bad form.

This was parody, not serious speculation about a real conversation that might have occurred. And it was meant to be humorous, not "maligning". Lighten up.

Pardon the DCP fanboy. Only DCP is allowed to post such parodies.

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:52 pm 
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Paul Osborne wrote:
zzyzx wrote:
So are the scroll parts that LDSinc has now the same that Joseph told and showed the famous writer were written by Abraham, Moses and the gang? Is any of the scroll in LDSinc possession that old?

What LDSinc does have... do current scholars interpret it the same as Joseph Smith did in his explanation as contained in the Pearl of Great Price? Are Josephs and the current egyptologists interpretations close?


All of these questions should be answered by the President of the church, but we see that all of the Presidents are cowards. They haven't the guts to approach the flame of scrutiny and get burned doing it. Indeed, even President Monson, a nice guy he is, he is a coward. No need to go to the FARMER apologists that root in the mire of lies. They are not LDS Inc. The apologists are like clowns and disposable trinkets for the prophets, they are whores for the church.

Let the prophets step foward and answer the questions. Sue the prophets for answers because they are the biggest cowards of Mormonism. Those fools couldn't bring down fire out of heaven or part the sea. They deserve to be mocked! Awaay with them! They make big claims, "PROPHET, SEER, REVELATOR", and yet we see they have no real power. Someday, someone, will clean their clocks! Perhaps Nightlion will bring fire down upon them and destroy those liars.

Paul O
There has been no other "seer'ing or translating work" since Smith died. I guess god no longer need that on earth?

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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 8:59 pm 
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There has been no other "seer'ing or translating work" since Smith died. I guess god no longer need that on earth?


The successors have no balls. At least Joseph Smith had balls. I respect him for that. But we see that his successors are true cowards that surround themselves with yes men and ensure their success in worldly power.

I'd love to see Monson boy try and translate something, anything! He is truly a boy false prophet that needs to grow up and take a cue from Joseph! At least Joseph would stick his neck out. Monson is nutless.

Paul O


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 Post subject: Re: KEP
PostPosted: Sun Apr 04, 2010 9:08 pm 
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bcspace wrote:
I've yet to be presented with a valid reason to give it up, much less a convincing argument that the Book of Abraham is false.


As with all of your posts, you are simply in denial and like to say things that have no foundation in order to further the cause you champion. Here’ a few compelling reasons to know that the Book of Abraham is false:

1) Joseph Smith could not translate Egyptian. Either God failed in the translation, or Joseph Smith is a fraud.

2) The funerary text inserted into the bowels of a mummy is from the pagan book of the dead. The contents were inserted into the mummy to guide it in the afterlife, and not as a mailbox for some future grave robber to steal, send to America and have some charlatan buy it for $2400 and then “translate” into doctrine to include polygamy.

3) Joseph Smith claimed to know how to translate the pagan papyrus and started to write a book before he was killed. The EAG is still kept from critical examination as is the papyrus Joseph SMith used along with the "Book of Joseph" papyrus the Mormon church has in its possession. Why?

As you are a known sociopath that runs away from questions you have no answer for to appease the lemmings that believe you, understand your choices… you will be held accountable for making them. The itching ears need you... know that.

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