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 Post subject: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Sun Aug 19, 2012 10:58 am 
Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons

From the article
Quote:
The revelation may have lifted the ban, but it neither repudiated it nor apologized for it.

Quote:
Most Protestant denominations, however, gradually apologized for their past racism. In contrast, while Mormon leaders generically criticize past and present racism, they carefully avoid any specific criticism of past presidents and apostles, careful not to disrupt traditional reverence for the church’s prophets.


These are good points. Points I hope that church will eventually address.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 1:29 am 
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It's only a problem in so far as anti Mormons drive the discussion by lying about the ban being racist. Anyone familiar with the doctrine knows that the ban didn't come about because of someone's skin color.

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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 2:44 am 
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bcspace wrote:
It's only a problem in so far as anti Mormons drive the discussion by lying about the ban being racist. Anyone familiar with the doctrine knows that the ban didn't come about because of someone's skin color.


Bwahahahahahaha :lol: :lol: :biggrin:

It sure would have been interesting had the church moved South instead of West. I bet Brigham would have made the church a safe haven for all them colored folk. A real big sign welcoming them to shine that iron rod all the white folk needed to hold onto.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 3:54 am 
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bcspace wrote:
It's only a problem in so far as anti Mormons drive the discussion by lying about the ban being racist. Anyone familiar with the doctrine knows that the ban didn't come about because of someone's skin color.


But you don't know why the ban came about, so racism remains a possibility.

Quote:
"For a time in the church there was a restriction on the priesthood for male members of African descent," Purdy said. "[u]It is not known precisely why, how or when this restriction began in the church but what is clear is that it ended decades ago. Some have attempted to explain the reason for this restriction but these attempts should be viewed as speculation and opinion, not doctrine[/u]. The church is not bound by speculation or opinions given with limited understanding."
Michael Purdy (official spokesperson for the Church quoted on Deseret News

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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 6:11 am 
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bcspace wrote:
It's only a problem in so far as anti Mormons drive the discussion by lying about the ban being racist. Anyone familiar with the doctrine knows that the ban didn't come about because of someone's skin color.


On the one side we have racist statements by Brigham Young, Joseph Fielding Smith, and many other church leaders. On the other had we have the priesthood ban. Can you at least admit that an outsider might believe there is a correlation between those two things without calling on an anti-Mormon bias?

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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 7:37 am 
sansfoy wrote:
bcspace wrote:
It's only a problem in so far as anti Mormons drive the discussion by lying about the ban being racist. Anyone familiar with the doctrine knows that the ban didn't come about because of someone's skin color.


On the one side we have racist statements by Brigham Young, Joseph Fielding Smith, and many other church leaders. On the other had we have the priesthood ban. Can you at least admit that an outsider might believe there is a correlation between those two things without calling on an anti-Mormon bias?

YES, most definitely.

Particularly since Brigham Young took it upon himself to actually make the priesthood ban Church policy.


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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Mon Aug 20, 2012 7:52 am 
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liz3564 wrote:
sansfoy wrote:

On the one side we have racist statements by Brigham Young, Joseph Fielding Smith, and many other church leaders. On the other had we have the priesthood ban. Can you at least admit that an outsider might believe there is a correlation between those two things without calling on an anti-Mormon bias?

YES, most definitely.

Particularly since Brigham Young took it upon himself to actually make the priesthood ban Church policy.


It must be frustrating for BC Space when non-mormons look at the priesthood ban, and the official statements from past church leaders, and say, "That was racist" and a large chunk of TBMs look at the priesthood ban, and the official statements from past church leaders, and say "Wow, we used to be racist. I'm glad we don't teach that anymore." And the official statements from the church newsroom and spokespeople don't want to talk about it, but they do emphasizing that the church today opposes all racism. Meanwhile, BC Space bravely defends the doctrine.

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 Post subject: Re: Why Race Is Still a Problem for Mormons - New York Times
PostPosted: Tue Aug 21, 2012 1:28 am 
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1. The ban was not racist.
Explanation: read bcspace

2. In Iran there is no sex-discrimination.
Explanation: Iran has highest ratio of female to male undergraduates in the world, according to UNESCO. Female students have become prominent in traditionally male-dominated courses like applied physics and some engineering disciplines.


Quote:
36 universities have announced that 77 BA and BSc courses in the coming academic year will be "single gender" and effectively exclusive to men
Quote:
Under the new policy, women undergraduates will be excluded from a broad range of studies in some of the country's leading institutions, including English literature, English translation, hotel management, archaeology, nuclear physics, computer science, electrical engineering, industrial engineering and business management.
Quote:
the science and higher education minister, Kamran Daneshjoo, dismissed the controversy, saying that 90% of degrees remain open to both sexes and that single-gender courses were needed to create "balance"

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldne ... ities.html
3:17PM BST 20 Aug 2012

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